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Swoop
06-17-2009, 11:37 AM
Hi Everyone,

I've owned a 1999 4Runner and a 2003 4Runner and am now looking to purchase and older 4Runner with a manual transmission and turn it into a souped up offroad machine. :)

I'm looking at a 1997 4Runner and a 1994 4Runner and wanted to ask a few questions of you guys as I am a total noob when it comes to offroading and modding 4Runners. ;)

First, what should be my first mod for this? A lift? If so, how much of a lift and how much would something like that cost?

Second, is a 1994 4Runner with a 3-inch lift already in place and 186,000+ miles for $5,000 a decent purchase?

Third, where is a good place to hunt for 4Runner rigs already modded and for sale? Do you know of anyone selling one that has a manual transmission and is under $6,000?

Thanks for any info you can offer. I really appreciate it and look forward to being a part of your excursions sometime very soon!

-Swoop (Alan)

AxleIke
06-17-2009, 12:04 PM
Locker if it doesn't already have it. After that, some armor to protect the belly, and front/doors.

Hulk
06-17-2009, 12:28 PM
Sliders are always a good first mod too.

Might want to check out YotaTech:
http://yotatech.com/

Tch2fly
06-17-2009, 01:30 PM
The 3.0 motor 4 runners (95-older) will be a better fit for your budget but they are much less desirable than the 96-newer with 3.4 motors

There is a 1998 4R with supercharged 3.4 at Affordable Auto Center in Englewood for $5K (over 200k miles) so there are deals on newer trucks if you don't mind the miles.


Look at ToyTec for affordable lift kits.

Jacket
06-17-2009, 01:41 PM
I would focus my attention on a 3rd gen (95 - 2000) 4Runner with a factory E-locker in the rear. Buying it with the locker already in place allows you to use your mod money for sliders and other upgrades.

Swoop
06-17-2009, 02:43 PM
Thanks everyone for the great replies! I found a 97 SR5 with 173K miles for just under $5K - thinking that might be a good deal.

Can anyone recommend a good mechanic that might be able to look at a vehicle before I buy it - preferably in the Northern Denver/Broomfield area?

Also, I've never kept a 4Runner beyond 80K miles. How long should these babies last if well cared for? When the engine just can't give anymore, do you usually overhaul it or try to find a used one with less miles to replace it?

Again, I really appreciate your feedback.

I can't wait to be climbing these Colorado passes and getting farther down Engineer Pass than I did last year in my 2003 model. :rolleyes: My goal is to eventually check off a list of the highest Colorado passes travelled like Westin and Mosquito passes.

Squishy!
06-17-2009, 02:58 PM
I am a reliable Toyota Certified Tech. I think :confused:. jk. :D Or PowderPig, thefatkid, and maybe a few others.

AxleIke
06-17-2009, 03:22 PM
Also, I've never kept a 4Runner beyond 80K miles. How long should these babies last if well cared for? When the engine just can't give anymore, do you usually overhaul it or try to find a used one with less miles to replace it?
.

If well cared for, the 3.4L should easily hit 300k.

My dad's 97 is over 200k.

my 87 is at 300k.

80k is barely broken in for a toyota.

When the engine blows, just put in another one.

Swoop
06-17-2009, 03:29 PM
...

When the engine blows, just put in another one.

LOL! What does that usually run on average?

I just saw a black 2008 Urban Runner for the first time. WOW! That thing looks HOT! :)

Squishy!
06-17-2009, 04:35 PM
LOL! What does that usually run on average?

You can pick up a 3.4 at a salvage yard with a one year warranty for $500-$800 depending on the miles and accessories you need on it. I bought a blown Tacoma and spent $700 on an engine with 95,000 miles on it. Works out pretty nice. You could look for a Runner with a blown motor and throw in a used engine to save money too.

P.S.- An Urban Runner is just a Sport Edition with 18" Limited wheels, different seats and a Tom Tom.

Swoop
06-17-2009, 04:39 PM
Good to know.

I didn't realize that about the Urban Runner. Looks like extra body work has been done and different lights were done to this beauty I found on Wikipedia.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e6/4th_gen_modified.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e6/4th_gen_modified.jpg

Love the black wheels but could do without the Spyhunter-ish star in the center. ;)

Squishy!
06-17-2009, 04:46 PM
Can you say UBER Mall crawler? :D

Swoop
06-17-2009, 04:49 PM
LOL! Yeah, it's sitting a little low to the ground but I dig the all-black look. I would do a different set of all black wheels. It would be a great 2nd 4Runner if I could afford another!

Swoop
06-17-2009, 05:58 PM
Do any of you guys hit the Colorado Passes much? Is Mosquito or Imogene Pass still doable?

Swoop
06-18-2009, 12:26 PM
I think I lost all credibility when I posted that picture, LOL! :D

AxleIke
06-18-2009, 02:25 PM
Many, many people do the CO passes.

Keep an eye out here on the Triple Bypass thread. Other trips pop up here and there as well.

The newer model 4runners are starting to get more and more aftermarket support. Robbie, (powderpig on the forums here) has one and seems to really like it for DD/roadtrip stuff. His is not modded much, if at all, but he likes it.

Swoop
06-18-2009, 03:01 PM
I think I am going to stick to the 3rd generation models for sale and try to find a 5 speed version. This makes my selection much more limited but really makes a difference when going offroad, don't you agree?

Squishy!
06-18-2009, 03:13 PM
I think I lost all credibility when I posted that picture, LOL! :D


Totally guy. jk :lol:

wesintl
06-18-2009, 03:13 PM
a set of thornbirds ;)

Swoop
06-18-2009, 03:48 PM
LOL! Thanks guys! :) So, I shouldn't limit myself to manual transmission models only, in my search for a 3rd Gen?

DaveInDenver
06-18-2009, 04:05 PM
LOL! Thanks guys! :) So, I shouldn't limit myself to manual transmission models only, in my search for a 3rd Gen?
Only you can answer that. :-) There's no one right answer. Which do you prefer to drive? Either way might take some mods to get right for you. But know that with a stick if you intend to tackle relatively hard trails you will definitely need lower transfer case gears. OTOH with an auto overheating can be a problem, so nothing is perfect. Thing is no matter what, the truck will spend a lot more time on pavement getting to and from trails, sitting in traffic, crawling along in the snow. So if you hate driving a stick normally, then probably don't get one...

Swoop
06-18-2009, 04:23 PM
I have a manual tranmission car and our 2003 4Runner is automatic. I like them both - they both have their pros and cons. Manual is fun to drive, but maybe it wouldn't be as fun on a truck. I don't know. I have just heard that you MUST get manual tranmission if you're going offroad. "You'll slip and slide too much with automatics" is something I hear a lot. This is refreshing to hear because I am not dead-set on getting manual. Just learning and taking it all in from everyone - and I appreciate all of the great advice!

One of my first trips I want to take is to Marble and go down the Devil's Punchbowl. I've been facinated about that place for years now, but have only read about it and seen pictures of it. It sounds pretty challenging. I like the sign that says to stop and allow your brakes to cool before proceeding... ;)

wesintl
06-18-2009, 04:26 PM
One of my first trips I want to take is to Marble and go down the Devil's Punchbowl. I've been facinated about that place for years now, but have only read about it and seen pictures of it. It sounds pretty challenging. I like the sign that says to stop and allow your brakes to cool before proceeding... ;)

It's not really.. but fantastic scenery

http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=2109&highlight=double+triple&page=2

Swoop
06-18-2009, 05:23 PM
It's not really.. but fantastic scenery

http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=2109&highlight=double+triple&page=2


Wow, those are some great pics! I love photography and the Crystal Mill is still on my list of cool places to capture.

Rzeppa
06-18-2009, 05:50 PM
Rear locker. You will go more places with a rear locker than any lift, tires or engine swap.

Swoop
06-18-2009, 09:08 PM
So are lockers the same thing as locking differentials ? And they come stock on 3rd gens?

Rzeppa
06-18-2009, 10:14 PM
So are lockers the same thing as locking differentials ? And they come stock on 3rd gens?

Yes, locking differential. They were available as an option on 3rd gens as well as other Toyota 4x4s, and there are also many aftermarket lockers available as well...Detroits, ARBs, spools, Lock Rights, etc.

Swoop
06-19-2009, 09:04 AM
Yes, locking differential. They were available as an option on 3rd gens as well as other Toyota 4x4s, and there are also many aftermarket lockers available as well...Detroits, ARBs, spools, Lock Rights, etc.

Cool. I think I had that on my old 1999 4Runner but never used it. I believe it was just a button on the dash that you hit to lock it, right?

DaveInDenver
06-19-2009, 09:23 AM
Cool. I think I had that on my old 1999 4Runner but never used it. I believe it was just a button on the dash that you hit to lock it, right?
There would have been a 'RR Lock' button on the lower left of the dash. The 1999 is the most desired of the 3rd gen since it had a locker option, 5 speed option, the tallest suspension (i.e. least spongy springs) from the factory.

I disagree with Jeff only in so far as the first mod should be decent tires, but of the major modifications a rear locker is the most bang for the buck. That gets you the most increase in capability of anything. I would also consider sliders fairly soon. I kept pushing sliders off and my rocker panels showed it.

Tch2fly
06-19-2009, 09:29 AM
know. I have just heard that you MUST get manual tranmission if you're going offroad. "You'll slip and slide too much with automatics" is something I hear a lot.

:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:

Welcome home, you have been hangin out with the wrong folks ;)

I will never own another manual trans 4x4 even if I build a buggy :D

Swoop
06-19-2009, 09:41 AM
I should have never gotten rid of my 1999 but at the time I was financially in a bind and had a high car payment on that baby.

I just found a 2000 5-speed with locker and only 101K miles on it for $9K, but take a look at it; it has a black bumper on the front of it that just doesn't look right!

2000 4Runner (http://www.carsforsale.com/used_cars_for_sale/2000_Toyota_4Runner_100391507_1)

Does that look like the stock bumper or should I pull a Carfax on this to see if it was in a fender bender?

Swoop
06-19-2009, 10:05 AM
:lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao::lmao:

Welcome home, you have been hangin out with the wrong folks ;)

I will never own another manual trans 4x4 even if I build a buggy :D

LOL! :) Thanks for the candor - I appreciate all the help I can get.

Another question: Did the 2000 model have the same characteristics of the 1999 as far as the different suspension and height?

I'm so close to getting a new (3rd Gen) 4Runner - it's killing me! :)

nakman
06-19-2009, 10:07 AM
we've got one member here, Jaderunner, with a 2000 and it's a 5 speed + elocker. No idea on suspension though, but if you're going to build this up why worry as you'll be upgrading that anyway, right? :)

Swoop
06-19-2009, 10:12 AM
we've got one member here, Jaderunner, with a 2000 and it's a 5 speed + elocker. No idea on suspension though, but if you're going to build this up why worry as you'll be upgrading that anyway, right? :)

True, but this will have to happen over time. So, I'm just trying to gain as much advantage by getting these "bonuses" already included.

It looks like a locker is about $1000 or so, just for the part, so I would prefer to find a 4Runner with that already included.

Mountain Drew
06-19-2009, 10:24 AM
Psh... I don't know what you guys are talking about.. a new Stereo needs to be the first mod! ;) people should be able to hear you from a mile away....hearing if for chumps! :D

Swoop
06-19-2009, 10:25 AM
Psh... I don't know what you guys are talking about.. a new Stereo needs to be the first mod! ;) people should be able to hear you from a mile away....hearing if for chumps! :D

Don't forget the set of fuzzy dice! :p:

DaveInDenver
06-19-2009, 10:29 AM
we've got one member here, Jaderunner, with a 2000 and it's a 5 speed + elocker. No idea on suspension though, but if you're going to build this up why worry as you'll be upgrading that anyway, right? :)
This is pretty much spot on. The 2000 model suspension is the only difference AFAIK (and we're talking like an inch in ride height at most), but 2000 was the last year that the locker and 5 speed were available. Like Nak says, the suspension is fixable and since the '99s are 10 years old now they are probably sitting on worn out springs and shocks anyway. Oh, also realize that even if you get a newer 4Runner you can retrofit the factory locker pretty easily in any 1996-2002 4Runner, since they all used the 8" axle even without a locker. The wiring will be there, just add the dash switch and third member (with a little grinding). Really the only major question is 5 speed or not, because that's sorta a PITA to swap over between needed difference ECUs and cutting holes and all that.

Mountain Drew
06-19-2009, 10:30 AM
YA! Probably needs some spinning rims too.. then a snorkel... you can never go wrong with one of those... It will get you chick man! ;)

Swoop
06-19-2009, 10:37 AM
I wonder why they discontinued the locker in 2001? Was it a problem for Toyota?

Did you guys see the 4Runner For Sale above? What did you think?

Here's the link (http://www.carsforsale.com/used_cars_for_sale/2000_Toyota_4Runner_100391507_1)again.

subzali
06-19-2009, 10:57 AM
That black bumper does look kinda goofy. I would run a Carfax on it and see if that truck rearended someone - if it was enough to replace the bumper the airbags might have gone off too...

Every 80 series Land Cruiser that was imported to the US was an automatic (and they go everywhere - just check the 80 series section on IH8MUD.com).

Manual or Automatic - whatever floats your boat or just take whatever you can find. If you find a truck that is in great shape with low miles and a locker personally I would take it regardless of the tranny - you're just as likely to find one that's trashed, thrashed, with high miles for the same price :rolleyes: (at least that's what I found when I was looking for my Tundra).

First thing I would do once I got one would be to change/check all the fluids (engine, tranny, t-case, diffs, brakes, coolant (make sure it has Toyota red, and if it doesn't flush it and replace it with some), clutch (if applicable). Check the brake pads/shoes, grease the driveshafts, steering components, change the air filter, spark plugs, cap, rotor, wires if needed. Depending on miles, check the wheel bearings, get an alignment, get good tires on it, make sure the headlights are good (not old, yellow, out of whack), and clean the interior and exterior and underbody real good, checking for rust, leaks, etc. and make sure the frame is clear of mud and junk.

After all that (and that may take some time and $$ depending on what's needed - fluids and tuneup items add up pretty fast and an alignment by itself is about $70), if it has a locker, great. Don't do much else, just drive it - take it on trips and get used to the feel of it. Figure out how to get a radio (CB or Ham - in this club it's worth studying up for the Ham exam and getting your license) in it so trail communication comes easy. Even if it doesn't have a locker that's where I would start, I think it's good to learn how to drive off-road without a locker so you can appreciate the capability of the vehicle. I would probably put an ARB-style bumper on it first (because IH8deer). Then I would look into getting a locker, if it didn't come equipped with one. Then a lift and sliders. And a winch. And then drive it some more. Just :twocents:

Yes, many of us hit up the high mountain passes every year. Red Cone/Webster Pass/Radical Hill are usually run every year, Mosquito Pass, Cameron Pass, Tomichi Pass, Cumberland Pass, Tincup Pass alternate as routes on the annual Ghost Town Run (coming up in July) (http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=9902), Taylor Pass, Pearl Pass, Schofield Pass (as Wes posted) are usually involved with the annual Triple Bypass (coming up in August) (http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=9892), and Engineer Pass, Cinnamon Pass, Black Bear Pass and Imogene Pass are usually involved with the annual Ouray Trip (over Labor Day weekend) (http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=9893). I am hoping to maybe next year do a trip (maybe with CLC (http://forum.ih8mud.com/co-colorado-land-cruisers/)) down to Hayden Pass, camp over at the Sand Dunes, then come back over Medano Pass, and there are many many more that are usually run by someone in the club over the course of a typical year. Welcome! :)

Mountain Drew
06-19-2009, 11:22 AM
I don't claim to know everything about 4-Runners but I feel like the information I have might help you. I'm just a kid with a 4-Runner who drives it off road with some really awesome guys.

In my opinion that is a really nice 4-Runner and I would buy it. I have a 1996 Runner with a 3.5" lift 33" tires a bumper and snorkel. I don't have sliders or a rear bumper or a rear locker, and I have have never hit the body, or the rear bumper.

When I was starting, for me it was about money and where I wanted to go. So I would say that your first mod would depend on how much money you want/can spend and where you plan to take it after your first mod. I put the bumper and tires on first, mainly because I did not want to have a wrecked car if I got in an accident. When I had more money I put my lift on, and when I get some more money I'll put sliders and a rear bumper on. My lift was about 400$ but you could spend all kinds of money on a lift. But for now I am very pleased with how much money I have spent on it, and how capable it is.

I hope some of the my information will help you in deciding what you are going to do.

corsair23
06-19-2009, 12:15 PM
Either someone painted the bumper for some unknown and whacked out reason or it isn't the original bumper....Regardless, I would HIGHLY encourage running a Carfax on every vehicle you consider...Not a guarantee that it will catch every problem but adds some piece of mind...

Get the 30 day unlimited plan or whatever it is and don't rush things. Unless you have to have a truck right now, today, look until you find the perfect, or near perfect, one for you. You'll probably have it for a long time so spend the time getting what you want...

Oh, and I'm with Mike...Get an automatic :) - Unless you are just wanting that much more of a challenge when running trails? Imagine you are climbing a hill, with rocks, etc. and trying to gently get over the obstacles...You have to stop. With an automatic, you hit the brakes :) - with a manual you have to hit the brakes, push in the clutch (unless you want the engine to die anyway), and then figure out how to synch everything back up to get going again...The only way around that is what Dave mentioned earlier about lower gears in the Tcase, or a second box, or both...Can get real expensive quick. AxleIke has a video somewhere of his truck crawling along as he walks next to it...Pretty :cool: but I still prefer an auto for everyday pavement pounding which is what most of our trucks do 95% of the time :(

DaveInDenver
06-19-2009, 12:47 PM
with a manual you have to hit the brakes, push in the clutch (unless you want the engine to die anyway), and then figure out how to synch everything back up to get going again
With lower transfer gears, the mighty 22R-E does not stall much... Amazing how with 100:1 total reduction and two lockers those little gerbils can power even IFS up stuff.

BTW, Cheeseman showed me to a super fly way to deal with the starting problem. It is soooo slick, makes you slushbox guys look Neanderthal in comparison. The gear reduction starters in our trucks have generate plenty of torque when you're in 1st with Marlin low (LOVE 4.7 gears!) to drag you up a hill. So by cranking with the truck in gear it will actually drive you up an obstacle AND start the truck at the same time. That is awesome! Used this probably 2 dozen times on the Rubicon and probably 3 times on gas can hill alone.

Use the 'Con as an example. Most of you guys were running stock auto and stock t-case in your 80s and even stock R&P ratios. The mods were lifts and 35" tires. I mostly kept up with you but I have super low R&P gears (5.29) and super low t-case (4.7) to do it with a 5 speed. Even Greg, who schooled us all, is running lower diff gears and a dual case Ultimate. So autos really do make a major difference in crawling ability.

nakman
06-19-2009, 01:20 PM
Use the 'Con as an example. Most of you guys were running stock auto and stock t-case in your 80s and even stock R&P ratios. The mods were lifts and 35" tires. I mostly kept up with you but I have super low R&P gears (5.29) and super low t-case (4.7) to do it with a 5 speed. Even Greg, who schooled us all, is running lower diff gears and a dual case Ultimate. So autos really do make a major difference in crawling ability.


Who was running a stock R&P? I think all the 80's were 4.88's, and on 35's that's slightly less than stock. Not that it matters, or changes the point any, but this seem to be the only thread with some action today so I gotta post something! (can you tell I'm logged in from home today? it's lonely down here...)

Swoop
06-19-2009, 01:20 PM
... and Engineer Pass, Cinnamon Pass, Black Bear Pass and Imogene Pass are usually involved with the annual Ouray Trip (over Labor Day weekend) (http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=9893). ... Welcome! :)

Thanks for the great info! :)

I have heard that Black Bear Pass's switchbacks can be so tight that it's hard for the longer vehicles like 4Runners to even take the turn. Is it a pretty difficult drive? What's the hardest drive in Colorado?

nakman
06-19-2009, 01:25 PM
Thanks for the great info! :)

I have heard that Black Bear Pass's switchbacks can be so tight that it's hard for the longer vehicles like 4Runners to even take the turn. Is it a pretty difficult drive? What's the hardest drive in Colorado?

If you can get yourself out of the parking lot after a football game, you can drive down Blackbear pass, IMO... but yes with few exceptions reverse will be needed at least twice, iirc. Really nbd.

Hardest drive? that's easy, I-76 headed out towards Nebraska. man that has to be the most boring drive we got, very hard to stay awake! :lmao:

DaveInDenver
06-19-2009, 01:29 PM
Hardest drive? that's easy, I-76 headed out towards Nebraska. man that has to be the most boring drive we got, very hard to stay awake!
Vail Pass eastbound in a heavily laden Hilux trying to not get run over.

wesintl
06-19-2009, 02:02 PM
Vail Pass eastbound in a heavily laden Hilux trying to not get run over.
amen.. wait, I mean, uh.. that is no fun in the BJ either. I had a friggen escalade pass me on the shoulder doin 80 while i was in the slow lane doing 15 and the fast lane was doin 80 too. nightmare.

I don't know the first thing about fortuners but a 2 1/2 lift, tires and locker in the rear will take you almost anywhere you'll want to go.

Red_Chili
06-19-2009, 02:08 PM
...Oh, also realize that even if you get a newer 4Runner you can retrofit the factory locker pretty easily in any 1996-2002 4Runner, since they all used the 8" axle even without a locker. The wiring will be there, just add the dash switch and third member (with a little grinding).
Nope. 8.3" axle in the non-lockers, AFAIK. Easy enough to swap the housing with the locker diff though. Be mindful of whether the housing is ABS or not; can't swap axle shafts between the two (unless you cheat like Mr. Bill has been known to do... we'll see how his works out). So after verifying gear ratios, just grab the whole shebang from the boneyard and slip it under the Runnerhiney.

DaveInDenver
06-19-2009, 02:10 PM
Nope. 8.3" axle in the non-lockers, AFAIK. .
That's with the Tacoma, non-locked trucks have 8.4" axles (same third as T100 and Tundra). All the 3rd gen 4Runners have 8" axles locker or not. The retrofit is the same as our older junk, clearance the housing and bolt in. It could very well be easier to get the whole axle to swap rather than modifying the housing, that is certainly a fair option. But you don't have to.

AxleIke
06-19-2009, 02:24 PM
With lower transfer gears, the mighty 22R-E does not stall much... Amazing how with 100:1 total reduction and two lockers those little gerbils can power even IFS up stuff.

BTW, Cheeseman showed me to a super fly way to deal with the starting problem. It is soooo slick, makes you slushbox guys look Neanderthal in comparison. The gear reduction starters in our trucks have generate plenty of torque when you're in 1st with Marlin low (LOVE 4.7 gears!) to drag you up a hill. So by cranking with the truck in gear it will actually drive you up an obstacle AND start the truck at the same time. That is awesome! Used this probably 2 dozen times on the Rubicon and probably 3 times on gas can hill alone.

Use the 'Con as an example. Most of you guys were running stock auto and stock t-case in your 80s and even stock R&P ratios. The mods were lifts and 35" tires. I mostly kept up with you but I have super low R&P gears (5.29) and super low t-case (4.7) to do it with a 5 speed. Even Greg, who schooled us all, is running lower diff gears and a dual case Ultimate. So autos really do make a major difference in crawling ability.

I have stalled mine out ONCE. To give you an example of the reduction you can get, one of the reasons that I love my ultimate is that, when decending a high ledge, or a big drop off of any sort, I can go low low 1st, stand on the brakes with out depressing the clutch, and the truck will not stop, but will descend at the perfect speed.

The stall out was when all 4 tires were jammed up in Moab. I was trying to let the truck go up at an idle.

2 lockers and lots of gears will get you mighty far. I have had no lift up until very recently.

Nope. 8.3" axle in the non-lockers, AFAIK. Easy enough to swap the housing with the locker diff though. Be mindful of whether the housing is ABS or not; can't swap axle shafts between the two (unless you cheat like Mr. Bill has been known to do... we'll see how his works out). So after verifying gear ratios, just grab the whole shebang from the boneyard and slip it under the Runnerhiney.

x2 on Dave's post. 4runners are all 8". Only Taco's came with the 8.4.

corsair23
06-19-2009, 02:35 PM
Vail Pass eastbound in a heavily laden Hilux trying to not get run over.

x2, only in a loaded down 80 pulling a popup...You know you are going slow when the fully loaded semis are passing YOU going up the hill :hill:

EDIT: as to a real answer, don't know...Holy Cross maybe? I've only done the easier stuff like around Ouray and local to Denver metro. I guess it depends if you are asking about technical driving, or scary off camber stuff that while isn't tough will make you pucker :D

Tch2fly
06-19-2009, 02:37 PM
when decending a high ledge, or a big drop off of any sort, I can go low 1st, step on the brakes with out depressing a clutch, and the truck will not stop, but will descend at the perfect speed.

:thumb: Yep me too!! :thumb:



:lmao:

;)

subzali
06-19-2009, 04:07 PM
Thanks for the great info! :)

I have heard that Black Bear Pass's switchbacks can be so tight that it's hard for the longer vehicles like 4Runners to even take the turn. Is it a pretty difficult drive? What's the hardest drive in Colorado?

Take your pick - Blanca Peak Road, 24 Road, Independence down in Penrose, or Carnage Canyon up by Buena Vista. There may be others, but those are basically buggy roads - don't think your runner is going there anytime soon ;)

Now for most difficult trail that Rising Sun would go to as a large group? Probably Holy Cross or Iron Chest (if it's still open). And Chinaman's and Spring Creek are getting worse over time. Every other trail (including Chinaman's and Spring Creek) my non-lifted FJ40 on 31s with a rear locker (see sig line) has gone.

Now if we talk about Moab or snow runs, that's a different story...

Tch2fly
06-19-2009, 04:14 PM
Now for most difficult trail that Rising Sun would go to as a large group?

We need a Blanca run! :thumb:

AxleIke
06-19-2009, 04:26 PM
We need a Blanca run! :thumb:

That'd be awesome!

AxleIke
06-19-2009, 04:28 PM
Take your pick - Blanca Peak Road, 24 Road, Independence down in Penrose, or Carnage Canyon up by Buena Vista. There may be others, but those are basically buggy roads - don't think your runner is going there anytime soon ;)

Now for most difficult trail that Rising Sun would go to as a large group? Probably Holy Cross or Iron Chest (if it's still open). And Chinaman's and Spring Creek are getting worse over time. Every other trail (including Chinaman's and Spring Creek) my non-lifted FJ40 on 31s with a rear locker (see sig line) has gone.

Now if we talk about Moab or snow runs, that's a different story...

x2.

RS guys who run the extreme trails generally do so in smaller groups, due to the nature of the trails, since the trails can take 8hrs to go a mile or less.

The hardcore group is growing though, Swoop, so, if that type of thing catches your fancy down the road, you'll likely have a great group of people to go with. Heck, right now, there is a great group you could ride along with. Riding is tons of fun on those trails, as it's not you who is breaking down! :D

Rzeppa
06-19-2009, 04:53 PM
Oh, and I'm with Mike...Get an automatic :) - Unless you are just wanting that much more of a challenge when running trails? Imagine you are climbing a hill, with rocks, etc. and trying to gently get over the obstacles...You have to stop. With an automatic, you hit the brakes :) - with a manual you have to hit the brakes, push in the clutch (unless you want the engine to die anyway), and then figure out how to synch everything back up to get going again...The only way around that is what Dave mentioned earlier about lower gears in the Tcase, or a second box, or both...Can get real expensive quick. AxleIke has a video somewhere of his truck crawling along as he walks next to it...Pretty :cool: but I still prefer an auto for everyday pavement pounding which is what most of our trucks do 95% of the time :(

LOL! :lmao:

IH8automatics

Swoop
06-23-2009, 10:37 AM
You guys all rock with the great info and advice you've given! I can't wait to join you once I get my 4Runner. :)

Do most of you have 2 sets of wheels/tires - one for off-road and one for on? I wonder if my extra set of 2003 4Runner (wife's car) rims would fit a 3rd Gen 4Runner...

nakman
06-23-2009, 10:39 AM
A few guys have multiple sets of wheels & tires, and even fewer switch them for city/mountain life. Most just run the big meats all the time.. :hill: :perry:

Swoop
06-23-2009, 10:57 AM
... Most Just Run The Big Meats All The Time.. :hill: :perry:

Lmao!! :hill:

TIMZTOY
06-23-2009, 05:06 PM
yea the rims will fit as long as there all 6 lug.. toyota never changed there lug pattern as far as im aware.. excpt between modles

Rzeppa
06-23-2009, 05:13 PM
Do most of you have 2 sets of wheels/tires - one for off-road and one for on? I wonder if my extra set of 2003 4Runner (wife's car) rims would fit a 3rd Gen 4Runner...

I've done that before. Finally ended up simply driving on my BFG M/Ts every day. Even with air tools it's extra time prepping and un-prepping for a daily driver which is also your weekend trail rig.