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daisydog34
01-12-2010, 01:16 PM
Dunno if this belongs in this section or general chit chat, but it's kinda tech.

I am going to go look at an '88 runner today to possibly become a daily driver. Right now I drive the tow rig (02 Ford power chicken) and its getting kinda expensive (fuel, tires, maint...) and the miles are stacking up on something that was intended for towing to go play :)

So I decided that I should look for a DD. I found an '88 runner SR5 22-RE 5 spd. Going to look at it tonight. Was wondering if there is anything in paticular to look for mechanically as I have very little experience with the 22-RE. Also is there anybody out there that drives one of these daily? How does it hold up? Whats the MPG like? I only drive about 40 miles round trip so its not a whole hell of a lot but it does add up!

Thanks in advance!

subzali
01-12-2010, 01:31 PM
timing chain is about the only thing that you need to be aware of. Somewhere around 160K miles the plastic timing chain guides start to become brittle enough that they break and the chain can eat into the timing chain cover. So all that stuff needs to be replaced sometime around then, typically. The timing chain cover has a face against the head gasket, so the head gasket is supposed to be done at that time as well.

Otherwise, if it shifts well and has been well maintained there's not much that I can think of that is a "gotcha" type item - everything else is what wears out on anything else...clutch would be at your typical interval of 150K or so miles, depending in driver...

I had a '91 2wd truck that got between 24 and 29 mpg regularly...4runner is a little heavier so I'd expect high teens to low 20s, depending on your foot. Not the gutsiest thing out there but it gets you back and forth to work. Good vehicles, you can expect them to go well upwards of 200K if it's been well maintained...

daisydog34
01-12-2010, 01:39 PM
Thanks for the info on the timing chain, I will have to see what I can find out about that!

I know these things can last forever, I had a buddy in HS that had a mini truck ran that thing till it had 250K on it with out doing a thing, blew the motor only because he missed a gear while shifting! Replaced the motor 7 years ago and he is still driving it to work now with over 375K on the chassis and axles, these vehicles never ceist(SP) to amaze me :)

rover67
01-12-2010, 01:46 PM
I have noticed that the timing chain slapping around in there sounds a lot like an exhaust leak. So if you hear an exhaust leak and can't find one.... maybe it's the chain.

I don't know anything else about them.

subzali
01-12-2010, 01:59 PM
It also can sound like a drive belt is missing some teeth...so if you hear something coming from the front don't freak out until you've checked your belts!

And yes, like your friend sometimes they keep going and going without doing anything to them. In my case the guides had started to break apart at just over 160K, so it was a good thing I got in there when I did...YMMV

SteveH
01-12-2010, 03:07 PM
My '89 22RE's timing chain guides failed at 175K, and I had a buddy do the head gasket and pull the oil pan as well. The chunks end up in the oil pan. The 5 speed tranny started getting noisy as well, and the clutch was fried, too, so I had the trans rebuilt and the clutch replaced. Do not use '555' engine parts - esp. the timing chain hydraulic tensioner - mine got weak after 6 mo, and the chain would clatter on startup. This brand is known for this. Very annoying. Genuine Toyota parts are much more expensive.

I got 20 MPG most of the time - a little less in the winter, and more on the highway. I finally got tired of being unable to go 75 in a headwind on E470 returning from the airport (at least that's the event that stuck in my mind).

A fun, tough, compact truck - removable top - much to like - just not a good long-haul highway rig. My '98 3rd gen 5 speed, however, is a big improvement in power/comfort, with the same gas mileage and a locking rear diff.

corsair23
01-12-2010, 03:34 PM
Buy a car :)

You know if you buy an '88 4Runner it will only be a matter of time before you start modding it for the trails :hill:

subzali
01-12-2010, 03:46 PM
True, I would into a Subaru Impreza or something if I was in your position (already have a truck and a toy plus a DD for the wife). Subaru will zip around a lot better and get better mileage, and AWD is all you really need for winter DD routines, and is a lot more than a lot of other people have who are out on the roads in the snow...

daisydog34
01-12-2010, 03:49 PM
Buy a car :)

You know if you buy an '88 4Runner it will only be a matter of time before you start modding it for the trails :hill:

Already started thinking about it:D Thinking that i might make it into an slightly modified rig for going on the easy runs like say the ghost town run. Much easier than dealing with a trailer queen!

daisydog34
01-12-2010, 03:51 PM
True, I would into a Subaru Impreza or something if I was in your position (already have a truck and a toy plus a DD for the wife). Subaru will zip around a lot better and get better mileage, and AWD is all you really need for winter DD routines, and is a lot more than a lot of other people have who are out on the roads in the snow...

Ya the thought crossed my mind, but thats about as far as it made it. I have this thing for cars...cant stand them, dont feel safe either. I will however make an exception for muscle cars, but then all those do is get a person in trouble with the law ;)

corsair23
01-12-2010, 03:53 PM
Already started thinking about it:D Thinking that i might make it into an slightly modified rig for going on the easy runs like say the ghost town run. Much easier than dealing with a trailer queen!

I think those same thoughts ran through Nakman's mind about his Taco and now look at it :D

I'm not much of a car guy either...Luckily for me though I don't have the skillz you do for modding stuff so the temptation is lower for me :hill:

subzali
01-12-2010, 03:54 PM
yep. I liked your idea of using the 4runner for easier runs and other high-clearance type needs. That's kinda why I chose a Tundra as my DD over a car. At least for now.

corsair23
01-12-2010, 03:54 PM
You could save yourself the trouble and just jump in with both feet and pick this up :D

http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=11780

daisydog34
01-12-2010, 03:58 PM
You could save yourself the trouble and just jump in with both feet and pick this up :D

http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=11780


Ya I LOVE that runner so clean and nice, used to see it around Windsor all the time when I worked there.

But if I picked that up I would miss out on all the fun of building it up myself:)
Lets leave that one for somebody that doesn't have the skills/time/tools to do it them selves!

Man Jerk
01-12-2010, 04:00 PM
I've DD'd an 86 4runner for about 2.5 years.

It's alright as a DD, not great. Stuff is going to wear out and there will be some sunday night wrench fests so you can get to work on monday. Nature of the beast.

I don't think I've ever gotten 20 mpg. Hi teens. Mine could probably be tuned better, but I can never keep my foot off the floor. Oh, and don't expect to go anywhere in a hurry because you won't. It's faster than my old FJ60, but still pretty slow.

Even throwing 31's on it will slow you down.

I don't know if you have kids or not, but no back door kind of sucks. I've been loading my daughter in the back since she was born 20 months ago, and it's always a bit of a chore. Not horrible, but still a chore.

Overall I really like my runner. Cost of ownership is low. Parts are easy to come by. You can wheel it. I've got 31's, a rear locker and sliders. I can put it places that would suprise you.

Red_Chili
01-12-2010, 06:41 PM
You'll get ~20mpg if
a) compression is good and the motor is tight
b) you keep your foot out of the TB (yeah right)
c) your O2 sensor is fresh-ish. Really.

I got 19 out of the Chili, highway speed, with wind, topper rolled up, using hypermiler techniques, with a 3.4 and 35s. Other than that it was identical. :lmao:

But with 31s & a 22RE I would get 19-20 without that level of effort. Fun truck. Beware the disease... bwahahahaaaaaa.....

daisydog34
01-12-2010, 08:39 PM
Beware the disease... bwahahahaaaaaa.....

So ya in spirit of the "disease" I am the proud owner of yet another vehicle. One ugly '88 Runner!

LET THE TRANSFORMATION BEGIN:D

AddictedOffroad
01-12-2010, 10:02 PM
I have owned at least 10 1st gen 4runners. 8 were 22REs. I have really learned how to tune these motors to get 24mpg on a regular basis.

With a proper valve adjustment, timing set around 8* with the test jumper grounded out, new cap/rotor, and some NGK plugs, I have yet to see one not get over 20mpg.

The 22RE may be the easiest motor to work on too. FSMs are readily available online as well. Even a brand new long block only runs around $1150.

Even my built ones will get 19mpg with 5.29s and 37s.

daisydog34
01-13-2010, 07:13 AM
Thanks for the info on the tune up Scotty, I was planing on doing a tune up this weekend on it any way. It did pretty good coming home from Denver last night. Has a little rear end vib on deceleration above 60mph. Probably just a D-shaft bearing cap, will look more into that tonight in the day light!

AxleIke
01-13-2010, 08:17 AM
Yeah, timing chain is the only real issue. Mine gave out at 250k.

Make sure it upshifts well. Likely downshifting into first, the syncro's are worn out, so that will be tough even on a good tranny. I've had to double clutch mine since about 190k.

Check for rear pinion leaks, and torn CV boots up front.

Other than that, with a well tuned motor and stock wheels/tires, I'd expect you to see 20 mpg pretty regularly.

Rzeppa
01-14-2010, 06:28 PM
X2 on the timing chain, and especially the after market guides and tensioner, see my post in the Avero thread. In defense of the 555 brand, they do make decent aftermarket TREs and other stuff for 40s.

Red_Chili
01-15-2010, 08:09 AM
Two common problems with the timing chain replacement (I researched it pretty thoroughly when rebuilding the '93):
1) folks get the bolts confused for the tensioner, make sure the bolt that came out is the same one that goes in.
2) folks overtorque the tensioner, and distort it. Won't work right after that. This is WAY more common than you would expect. If you torque by feel you have overtorqued it.
3) Machining debris is left in the tensioner and is not cleaned out, causing binding. This happens with Toyota OEM as well (remember, Toyota did not make this part; it may be that the aftermarket part you are trying to avoid is the very same one in the Toyota box that you paid more for).

Any one of these are easily dealt with, and any one of them can ruin the reliability of the timing chain.

<edit: snort...>
Two common problems ...
1)
2)
3)
... :lmao:

DaveInDenver
01-15-2010, 08:38 AM
Two common problems with the timing chain replacement (I researched it pretty thoroughly when rebuilding the '93):
1) folks get the bolts confused for the tensioner, make sure the bolt that came out is the same one that goes in.
2) folks overtorque the tensioner, and distort it. Won't work right after that. This is WAY more common than you would expect. If you torque by feel you have overtorqued it.
3) Machining debris is left in the tensioner and is not cleaned out, causing binding. This happens with Toyota OEM as well (remember, Toyota did not make this part; it may be that the aftermarket part you are trying to avoid is the very same one in the Toyota box that you paid more for).

Any one of these are easily dealt with, and any one of them can ruin the reliability of the timing chain.
Good points. FWIW, the company that made Toyota's 22R tensioners was OSK, so if you can find it boxed in OSK teal boxes or reboxed in Toyota red, NAPA or otherwise they will exactly be 'OE' quality. The problem is that unless it's in an OSK or Toyota box, it may or may not really be OSK and you won't know until you open it. And if NAPA happens to be OSK there is no guarantee that it will always be OSK since parts suppliers often change manufacturers and specs, even Toyota. So really the best way to buy the brand directly if you can, followed by Toyota which seems to still always be OSK.

Red_Chili
01-15-2010, 10:48 AM
Yep, found the same thing to be true of Toyota wheel bearings vs. CarQuest Blue Label (budget line). For a while, they were both identical Koyo (not for the same $$$ :D). Then they were Timken (CarQuest) for a while (still a good choice IMHO). Open the box and look.