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View Full Version : replaced injectors and ff, now running rough


nuclearlemon
01-17-2010, 02:00 PM
did rebuilt injectors from witchhunter, installed new oem fuel filter and cleaned just the dirty side of the t/b, got it all together and now the rig is running rough. haven't driven it, just fired it up in the driveway and revved it a bit. is this normal? will it smooth out in a bit? could i have a bad injector? can't find anything on mud, but still looking.

Romer
01-17-2010, 03:18 PM
Did you disconnect the battery to clear the ECU? Not sure this will take care of it, but if it had adjusted to take care of dirty injectors then its best to reset. That and maybe adjust your timing.

Uncle Ben
01-17-2010, 04:07 PM
Most likely there either a terminal pulled or messed up on the wire socket in an injector or you possibly got two injector plugs crossed. Easy visual is grey-brown-gray brown etc... Two grays or two browns next to each other would be your problem.

nuclearlemon
01-17-2010, 04:28 PM
batt was disconnected the whole time i was working on it and i've pulled it twice between running it. adjusting the dizzy does nothing for what sounds like some sort of miss or something. checked the injector plugs before i put it all back together since the 4 and 5 could easily get mixed up and they are on the correct injectors. i'm 99.9% sure evervything else is hooked up correctly. when installing the injectors, i did loosely bolt everything and then turn all the injectors back and forth before snugging it to make sure they were seated correctly.

treerootCO
01-17-2010, 07:08 PM
Did the crunchy wires by the EGR look ok when pulling the intake manifold?

nuclearlemon
01-17-2010, 08:19 PM
yes and no. they didn't feel crunchy, but there was a spot in the insulation that had heat marks. i have new stuff over the old stuff now.

J Kimmel
01-17-2010, 08:25 PM
are they all firing? sometimes they stick...

nuclearlemon
01-17-2010, 10:14 PM
no clue...fuel injection is new to me.

Snowrun
01-17-2010, 10:32 PM
What about the wires going to the MAS? Or what about the cables going to the throttle-body? What is it idling at? Broken intake hose?

corsair23
01-17-2010, 11:25 PM
Nothing real helpful other than the 80s tend to need to "relearn" how to run after disconnecting the battery...

Is it running really rough or just stumbling a bit at idle? I think I recall reading that it takes a minimum of 3 start/stop cycles for the ECU to relearn. Seems about right from what I've experienced every time I've disconnected the battery and the ECU resets. You can tell the rig isn't running like it should but I guess it is relative...

nuclearlemon
01-18-2010, 09:14 AM
was hoping it might clear up on the quick little drive to work, nope, runs like crap, sounds like a vw bus. did throw a code and i got all excited, but it was just a p304...i know it's misfiring...:rant:

rover67
01-18-2010, 09:34 AM
could all of the work knocked some crap loose in the fuel line and clogged an injector? pull the fuel rail and see fi the little screens have any junk in them.

rover67
01-18-2010, 09:36 AM
is it the same cylinder that is misfiring? I'm assuming so...

it's gotta be that one injector.... right?

so if it's wired right like UB said, it must not be firing for some other reason like Kimmel said.. you could pull it off and manually fire it to make sure it flows or see if it's stuck. then you could ckeck the screen too.

Squishy!
01-18-2010, 09:46 AM
Also while running you can pull the injector connector (if you can get to it, I don't remember on those) for the #4 cyl since your code is a P0304 and see if it runs worse or is unchanged. If it runs worse then continue with the rest and see if anything changes there. If it does not run worse then you know that is your dead cylinder. Could be spark, fuel or other things. Take the injector from the dead cyl (since this started after the work on injectors) and swap it with another injector and see if the problem follows it or stays.

nuclearlemon
01-18-2010, 11:13 AM
Also while running you can pull the injector connector (if you can get to it, I don't remember on those) for the #4 cyl since your code is a P0304 and see if it runs worse or is unchanged. If it runs worse then continue with the rest and see if anything changes there. If it does not run worse then you know that is your dead cylinder. Could be spark, fuel or other things. Take the injector from the dead cyl (since this started after the work on injectors) and swap it with another injector and see if the problem follows it or stays.

cool. so the last number in the code is the cylinder? too bad you can't get to it without pulling everything back apart.:rant: at least it gives me something to go on. won't be able to get to it until friday.

nuclearlemon
01-18-2010, 04:22 PM
had to run to ups at lunch and now it's throwing a p0301 also:(

Rzeppa
01-21-2010, 10:46 PM
Call Robbie (techeditor@tlca.org).:D

rover67
01-21-2010, 11:31 PM
more misfires..

I wonder if the injectors are clogged.. pull 'em and check them.

Beater
01-22-2010, 09:00 AM
I suspect wiring or connector. those wires are tiny and the insulation old.

DaveInDenver
01-22-2010, 09:12 AM
I suspect wiring or connector. those wires are tiny and the insulation old.
I would suspect that first, too, since Wintchhunter just cleaned the injectors. Not to say that they didn't go bad, but they tested OK on the bench at least. Disturbing the wires might have broken insulation. Or they or the fuel system clogged for the same reason, going poking around in 15 year old junk.

frontrange
01-22-2010, 09:18 AM
I have an injector test set you could borrow, but you would need a way to put a fuel pressure gauge on the system somewhere to use it. I don't recall Toyota putting a pressure test port anywhere on the system but I'm not a Toyota FI expert.

DaveInDenver
01-22-2010, 09:37 AM
I have an injector test set you could borrow, but you would need a way to put a fuel pressure gauge on the system somewhere to use it. I don't recall Toyota putting a pressure test port anywhere on the system but I'm not a Toyota FI expert.
On the 22R-E I've heard of people tapping the front plug of the fuel rail and installing a schrader valve for testing.

frontrange
01-22-2010, 09:49 AM
When I was collecting parts for my 2FE I think I used a Chevy Fuel rail to pressure test my Toyota injectors, I probably still have the test rail buried somewhere in the garage. The Chevy rails have the test port, IIRC it is just a 3/16 flare fitting with a schrader valve installed.

nuclearlemon
01-22-2010, 12:28 PM
testing the wires will be the first thing. i'll start by firing it up and jiggling the wires at the firewall, them proceed to trying to check the plug connections before i tear it all apart. hoping maybe a pin got pushed back in the connector or something. i'm hearing now, however that this is not an uncommon problem. a friend back east had one that bench tested good twice and was still bad, also crash said he talked to some experts who said they almost never do injectors for this reason :( wish i'd known that ahead of time.

DaveInDenver
01-22-2010, 12:42 PM
also crash said he talked to some experts who said they almost never do injectors for this reason
What do you mean 'never do injectors'? I had my set done at Witchhunter during the rebuild and didn't seem to hurt anything. Can't say if helped either because along with serviced injectors I changed the short block, head, cam, a bunch of sensors...

frontrange
01-22-2010, 12:44 PM
You'll want a tool called a noid light to test for the control signal at the injector connector. I also have a bunch of 3FE injectors that are cleaned and flow tested if you do find a bad one or two. I collected 3 sets of them back when I was collecting parts for the 2FE and many of them were hopelessly clogged. The ones that still flow at least a little can be cleaned to give a good spray pattern again.

Rzeppa
01-22-2010, 07:31 PM
Yoiks! :eek: Most Schrader valves are only designed for air or water service. I would not trust any old cheap elastomer seal in any old Schrader valve to hold up under constant exposure to aeromatic hydrocarbons (such as gasoline)!

rover67
01-22-2010, 07:36 PM
Yoiks! :eek: Most Schrader valves are only designed for air or water service. I would not trust any old cheap elastomer seal in any old Schrader valve to hold up under constant exposure to aeromatic hydrocarbons (such as gasoline)!

I don't know if the valves themselves have different seals on them but i've seen them all over fuel injected cars of older vintages..

frontrange
01-23-2010, 09:51 AM
Fuel systems and refrigeration systems have been using schrader valves with viton or nitrile O-rings for ages.

Squishy!
01-27-2010, 11:27 AM
Any luck Ige?

nuclearlemon
01-27-2010, 11:32 AM
got the no 4 issue resolved, still have an issue with no one and today i threw a p0402 on the way in...no time till fri to look at it tho.

Squishy!
01-27-2010, 11:59 AM
P0402 is excessive EGR flow. Maybe a stuck open EGR valve. What was wrong with the p0304?

nuclearlemon
01-27-2010, 06:09 PM
P0402 is excessive EGR flow. Maybe a stuck open EGR valve. What was wrong with the p0304?

no clue. i'm guessing something in the plug.

nuclearlemon
02-06-2010, 08:12 PM
finally got a chance to swap the #1 injector and it appears to be fine now, so the new injector appears to have been the problem. i'll run it tomorrow.

for future reference, you can swap the number one injector without pulling the intake. it's not pleasant, but it can be done.

i did lose one of the lower throttle body bolts and of course, it's longer than anything i've got.:( so i'll have to try to find something that will work on monday when i go to work.

Jacket
02-07-2010, 09:58 AM
Glad you finally got that one figured out Ige. What a pain in the ....

Any idea what was wrong with the new injector?

DaveInDenver
02-07-2010, 10:20 AM
Yoiks! :eek: Most Schrader valves are only designed for air or water service. I would not trust any old cheap elastomer seal in any old Schrader valve to hold up under constant exposure to aeromatic hydrocarbons (such as gasoline)!

http://www.schrader-bridgeport.com/index.php?option=com_sobi2&sobi2Task=sobi2Details&catid=2&sobi2Id=5&Itemid=59

Valve Cores

A Schrader® valve consists of a hollow cylindrical metal tube, typically brass, with the exterior end threaded. The interior end form varied depending on the application of the valve. In the center of the exterior end is a metal pin pointing along the axis of the tube; the pin's end is approximately flush with the end of the valve body.

Most Schrader® valves used on tires have threads and bodies with a standard exterior size allowing for universal caps and tools whether the tire is on an automobile, bicycle or even a wheelbarrow or lawnmower. A Schrader® valve can be used to control: Air, nitrogen, R12, R22, R134a, oils, Halon, SF6, Petrols, butane, propane.

mbella1
02-08-2010, 11:36 AM
Why did you replace the injectors? was it running rough before or just doing some mainteneace? It could be you got some debris in one of the injectors while installing it.

nuclearlemon
02-08-2010, 01:33 PM
just maintenance. my 80 had a hard life before i got it.

TIMZTOY
02-08-2010, 05:04 PM
did you ever get er running ? also if she;s not running still.. i know those 22re's have bad tps issues.. also test to make sure your getting injector pulse on all 4 injectors..

nuclearlemon
02-08-2010, 06:16 PM
did you ever get er running ? also if she;s not running still.. i know those 22re's have bad tps issues.. also test to make sure your getting injector pulse on all 4 injectors..

hhhmmmmm, first off, i got it running, see the post a few above, it appears it was the injector as i suspected. second, i don't have a 22re. third, i'm very happy i don't have just four cylinders, it would really be a dog then:D

TIMZTOY
02-09-2010, 02:00 PM
hhhmmmmm, first off, i got it running, see the post a few above, it appears it was the injector as i suspected. second, i don't have a 22re. third, i'm very happy i don't have just four cylinders, it would really be a dog then:D

yea i didnt read all the post i just skimed threw:lmao:glad its running