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View Full Version : In Tank EFI Pump Kit


rover67
06-23-2010, 10:41 AM
Has anybody used something like this to make a regular tank an in tank pump tank?

http://www.tanksinc.com/index.cfm/page/ptype=product/product_id=84/category_id=61/home_id=61/mode=prod/prd84.htm

My fuel tank has a 5/16" hard line coming out of it that I am beginning to think restricts flow too much and causes the early death of my inline fuel pump. It is always sounding like it is cavitating.

any other suggestions to convert to in tank?

I have the LRA 40 Gallon fuel tank from MAF by the way.

frontrange
06-23-2010, 12:47 PM
Interesting idea. I just made my own tank from scratch. Your inline pumps fail because they overheat. I've never seen one last more than a few months. There's a good reason why all new cars come with in-tank pumps.

http://i94.photobucket.com/albums/l116/scranage/fuel_tank.jpg

Air Randy
06-23-2010, 12:51 PM
Are you sure you don't have a restriction in the tank pick up unit? Could be something blocking the screen on the picku p or if it is flexible it could be kinked. A 5/16 hard line should otherwise be big enough to not create cavitation due to lack of flow.

rover67
06-23-2010, 01:30 PM
I think most folks plumb the supply line to be 3/8" I know that when I shut the motor down it drains back into the tank and requires the pump to reprime each time.

I at first thought that there was indeed something in the tank restricting flow, but I have visually checked that it is clean since then. At first I was getting garbage out of it but now it's clean.

yeah, the external inline pump really get's hot sometimes, and after running it for a while it get's louder. I was also thinking about going this route:


http://www.vetteworksonline.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=178&osCsid=7be8eca284bf4e3ec519eceefadd89f1

then it'd all be "stock"

powderpig
06-23-2010, 03:59 PM
I think which ever route you go, it would be wise to baffle (around the pump) it a bit if you can. Or maybe even get a FJ62 fuel tank that is already baffled(and set up for 43 psi fuel pump in stock form). This will keep a bit of fuel around the pump when you are on angles. This would create more work for you Marco, but in the end you would have less problems when you are pulling angles with lower fuel levels.

powderpig
06-23-2010, 04:02 PM
I tried to delete my last message. Is the LRA tank baffled around the area where you would stick the fuel pump? If not, it would be a good thing to create one.
Are you going to need to cut it for the new fuel pump or would it be a plug and play?

rover67
06-23-2010, 04:12 PM
I tried to delete my last message. Is the LRA tank baffled around the area where you would stick the fuel pump? If not, it would be a good thing to create one.
Are you going to need to cut it for the new fuel pump or would it be a plug and play?

The LRA tank is baffled quite a bit. the fuel takes a long time to slosh around in it. I am going to have to cut a hole in it to install anything I choose to use though since it only has a hole for the fuel level sender.

Right now the pickup goes to the sump which is built into the tank, I will loose that when I install the in tank pump.

i found a AC Delco Pump assembly new for a silverado on Ebay that i am going to pick up if it dosen't get too expensive, it seems to be the most reasonable "stock" way to go.

frontrange
06-23-2010, 08:03 PM
Careful cutting on that tank. The old shade tree mechanic's trick that I always use is to run an exhaust line into the tank till all oxygen is purged. Last time I did this I ran a line from my ATV and let the engine run for a half hour. No drama after that. If you are a welder and have an argon or CO2 setup that will work too.

rover67
06-23-2010, 08:31 PM
yeah, I was going to drain it and wash it out with soap and water till it was spotless, then probably leave it almost all the way full with water and purge the rest with argon while welding/cutting/drilling. I have used the exhaust trick before as well.

Corbet
06-24-2010, 12:50 PM
Marco, my FJ40 had a Ford external fuel pump on it connected to my Holley Pro Injection way back when. The pump never overheated or had to be replaced while I ran that system. I'm sorry I don't have more specs on it but might be a solution rather than cutting the tank.

rover67
06-24-2010, 02:01 PM
Any Idea what year ford it came off of?

I can do some digging on the innerweb and probably find it so no big deal if not..

frontrange
06-24-2010, 02:38 PM
If you have a port injected motor make sure you don't get a pump off of a TBI car. TBI runs half the pressure of a port injected system.

rover67
06-24-2010, 02:46 PM
If you have a port injected motor make sure you don't get a pump off of a TBI car. TBI runs half the pressure of a port injected system.

copy that.

I may be having issues due to the increased flow and pressure requirements of my motor. It is rated at 300hp and runs 60psi. I have been running walbro 225lph inline pumps for a few years now, they just don't seem to last very long.

Corbet
06-24-2010, 02:56 PM
Any Idea what year ford it came off of?

I can do some digging on the innerweb and probably find it so no big deal if not..

No clue as it was installed by the PO. Just know it probably put out 100psi or so and had to be regulated back as Pro Injection only needs like 15psi IIRC. I bought the 40 in 1998 so search older than that.

frontrange
06-24-2010, 02:58 PM
At 6000 ft above sea level a 300HP motor only puts out 200HP or so on a warm day. I'd say a 225 LPH pump is not going to be taxed on volume and they are all designed to run at high pressure, but the heat does kill them off early. I've tried many different brands of inline pumps on many applications over the years and never seen one last a year.

I also hear the Wabro's are widely counterfeited, so you may be getting cheesy Chinese knock-off's. I run a spare pump from my C4 Corvette in my tank. I've never seen one of them fail yet. The C4's LT1 was port injected and also rated at 300HP at the crank. The C4/LT1 (92-95) pump is quite small in diameter, and comes on a stalk with the fuel sender. It might be quite easy to retrofit one to your tank.

RedCreeper
06-24-2010, 08:20 PM
Seeing this post i had a pump go today on the truck. Rather than taking the tank down is it possible to just plump and pump in the line out side of the tank?

Oh and what a day it was after it died on the tollroad. Any suggestions would be great. thanks.

Art Volmer
06-24-2010, 08:44 PM
Hey Marco can you put a check valve in the line so the fuel does not drain back into the tank? Also the in-line pumps like to push fuel so the closer it is to the tank the better you are and the longer they will last.
As to what corbet was saying the Mustangs in the 80's had two pumps in their fuel system a low pressure in the tank and an external high pressure pump. Some of the euro cars are this way also.

Art Volmer
06-24-2010, 08:46 PM
Seeing this post i had a pump go today on the truck. Rather than taking the tank down is it possible to just plump and pump in the line out side of the tank?

Oh and what a day it was after it died on the tollroad. Any suggestions would be great. thanks.

Kenny you should fix your fuel pump the right way. What kind of car/truck is it? Most cars only take a few hours to drop the tanks and some(but very few) even have panels to access the pumps.
If the tank is full siphon if possible or drop it with some help and put it back up empty.

RedCreeper
06-24-2010, 10:04 PM
Art,

Its a 02 gmc 1500 HD. I know i should do it right. just going to be a long night. Looks like i need to get the ID tag info to get the right pump. Not sure why because when i went to get a price all the pumps had the same part number. pretty confusing. i just want to make sure i get the right one so i wont be running around all weekend trying to get this thing running. So tonight i will see if i can get it down and go from there. Hopefully wont be to hard but with it being so old i am bound to run into something. Thanks for the info.

Uncle Ben
06-24-2010, 11:24 PM
In-line high pressure pumps dont last. They get hot! In tank pumps actually leak a bit of gas which keeps them cool. I have seen some ingenious in-line sumps made that allow the use of an in-tank pump to work in a in-line set up. The best way to do things right when doing a EFI conversion into a carbed donor is to mod the tank so the factory type in tank pump matches the duty cycle of the injectors. This link is a cool option Marco! Solves a few problems. Snoop around for some fuel safe bulk head fittings and plumb your in-tank pump into you stock fuel line set up!

rover67
06-25-2010, 10:22 AM
Hey Marco can you put a check valve in the line so the fuel does not drain back into the tank? Also the in-line pumps like to push fuel so the closer it is to the tank the better you are and the longer they will last.
As to what corbet was saying the Mustangs in the 80's had two pumps in their fuel system a low pressure in the tank and an external high pressure pump. Some of the euro cars are this way also.

Yeah, I was working on a volvo the other day and noticed it had this type of arrangement. I think the best way to do it is to use the stock type internal pump.

UB, I agree completely and this is why I am taking this route. I actually am thinking about just getting the GM pump module from a silverado which should match the motor pretty well since ti would be what it was like when it was originally in a GM truck.

My current inline pump gets wicked hot, loud, and cavitates at the drop of a hat. It has caused me lots of headaches in the past and I am ready to move on.

Kenny, how ironic that your pump in the GM .. the exact one I want to put in, failed. I am still going this route, but hopefully it lasts for a little while longer than yours did.

It's funny how it has taken me almost three years of daily driving the truck to arrive at the fact that I have to do this, interesting how the thought process/development goes.

rover67
06-25-2010, 10:27 AM
Hey Marco can you put a check valve in the line so the fuel does not drain back into the tank? Also the in-line pumps like to push fuel so the closer it is to the tank the better you are and the longer they will last.
As to what corbet was saying the Mustangs in the 80's had two pumps in their fuel system a low pressure in the tank and an external high pressure pump. Some of the euro cars are this way also.


I got about 1 foot of hose between the pump and tanks, it's as close as I can get..

Didn't think about a check valve... it cavitates and starves while running too though.

Uncle Ben
06-25-2010, 03:04 PM
Yeah, I was working on a volvo the other day and noticed it had this type of arrangement. I think the best way to do it is to use the stock type internal pump.

UB, I agree completely and this is why I am taking this route. I actually am thinking about just getting the GM pump module from a silverado which should match the motor pretty well since ti would be what it was like when it was originally in a GM truck.

My current inline pump gets wicked hot, loud, and cavitates at the drop of a hat. It has caused me lots of headaches in the past and I am ready to move on.

Kenny, how ironic that your pump in the GM .. the exact one I want to put in, failed. I am still going this route, but hopefully it lasts for a little while longer than yours did.

It's funny how it has taken me almost three years of daily driving the truck to arrive at the fact that I have to do this, interesting how the thought process/development goes.


Marco, is your setup TBI or direct port? I ask because I have a '95 vintage Siverado pump and lines I do not need. I was considering using it on my 80 sub tank set up but I decided I would rather use my old 80 fuel pump instead.

rover67
06-25-2010, 03:25 PM
It is the later model direct port injection that requires 60psi. The motor is a 5.3 Vortec out of a 2003 vintage chevy something (probably a van or pickup).

Uncle Ben
06-25-2010, 04:01 PM
It is the later model direct port injection that requires 60psi. The motor is a 5.3 Vortec out of a 2003 vintage chevy something (probably a van or pickup).

Sorry....go fish! :rolleyes: ;)

rover67
06-28-2010, 12:30 PM
So does anybody have a later model silverado or tahoe that they can poke around underneath for me or let me do the same?

I am a bit confused on all the pumps they offer and how they are configured to plumb the fuel system..

prefereably it'd be a truck with a returnless fuel system like mine..

RedCreeper
06-28-2010, 01:44 PM
Marco,

I have a 02 GMC that i just did the pump. Not sure what you need since i did not read the posts but PM me and maybe i can help with what i learned or seen. Mine has the EVAP system if that means anything.

Kenny

rover67
06-28-2010, 01:52 PM
i'll pm ya!

rover67
08-03-2010, 08:21 AM
Well, thanks a million to kenny... I was able to take his old pump and dissect it to make sure it is what I needed. The new pump is installed and the truck runs great now.

here is the mud thread where I went through it all. I posted it up there for the vortec guys so folks could see what I did.

http://forum.ih8mud.com/60-series-wagons/394565-tank-fuel-pump-conversion.html

RedCreeper
08-03-2010, 10:10 AM
Glad i could help and it worked out. Now let go wheeling... oh i need brakes first.....