PDA

View Full Version : OK I can already tell.......


lilred4runner
08-12-2010, 07:52 PM
This is going to get me in trouble with the wife, but.... Yea it's another newbie question. How much would it cost me to do something like this http://www.fourwheeler.com/techarticles/5064_solid_axle_swap_toyota_4runner_pickup_2/index.html minus the 3.4L conversion. This is the kind of travel I would like to see in lilred. thinking winter project. 3.4l will need to come later. Tips and suggestions are always welcome.

FJBRADY
08-12-2010, 07:58 PM
This is going to get me in trouble with the wife, but.... Yea it's another newbie question. How much would it cost me to do something like this http://www.fourwheeler.com/techarticles/5064_solid_axle_swap_toyota_4runner_pickup_2/index.html minus the 3.4L conversion. This is the kind of travel I would like to see in lilred. thinking winter project. 3.4l will need to come later. Tips and suggestions are always welcome.

PM Scotty at Addicted Off Road

See his build below....oh and if you have to ask it might be too much! 10K, I dunno?

http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=12740

ttubb
08-12-2010, 08:59 PM
This is going to get me in trouble with the wife, but.... Yea it's another newbie question. How much would it cost me to do something like this http://www.fourwheeler.com/techarticles/5064_solid_axle_swap_toyota_4runner_pickup_2/index.html minus the 3.4L conversion. This is the kind of travel I would like to see in lilred. thinking winter project. 3.4l will need to come later. Tips and suggestions are always welcome.

This is really interesting. This is MY 4Runner, even down to the "XToy" decal on the rear window. Origin was All-Pro Off Road prototype SAS. Description is identical, down to the Marlin xfer.
Check it out....Even the tie rods are still red!

MDH33
08-12-2010, 09:15 PM
Maybe you should get out there and wheel some trails before planning your high dollar suspension upgrades. ;)

lilred4runner
08-12-2010, 09:37 PM
Thanks, I read an article about something that is new to me, with a ride that I already have and was interested how much this kind of upgrade would cost. The biggest problem I have and I have lots! if there are others able to and I can't I will find a way to. I may not end up with the top end goodies.... but I will find away to get what I need. Thats where I need to rely on a group such as yours to provide the checks and balances or knowledge and experience for me to make the right decisions for me.

And your right I just need to get out, but I also don't want to walk back.

So thanks again.

Maybe you should get out there and wheel some trails before planning your high dollar suspension upgrades. ;)

wesintl
08-12-2010, 09:52 PM
so solid axle swap, 4.88's, 35's and a lift? should only be a couple K. whadda I know anyway i'm a cruiser guy :hill:

Dr. Schlegs
08-12-2010, 09:59 PM
Make a plan and start buying parts. Then some winter work on you SAS swap.

lilred4runner
08-12-2010, 10:03 PM
Did you buy it already set up? or did you do it your self?

This is really interesting. This is MY 4Runner, even down to the "XToy" decal on the rear window. Origin was All-Pro Off Road prototype SAS. Description is identical, down to the Marlin xfer.
Check it out....Even the tie rods are still red!

ttubb
08-12-2010, 10:30 PM
Did you buy it already set up? or did you do it your self?

It was my son's. He purchased it with the SAS, 4.88s, Marlin, bumpers on it. I had a highly modified 80 that he needed for the room for three kids so we swapped.
As I said, it was Jon Bundurant's truck (All Pro Off Road) that he used as the prototype SAS. Last winter I did a 3.4 swap and added ARBs F&R, rebuilt the front and rear axles and drag links. Terry

corsair23
08-13-2010, 12:59 AM
Maybe you should get out there and wheel some trails before planning your high dollar suspension upgrades. ;)

A good suggestion before dropping the :twocents: on a SAS setup etc. While having the articulation of a SAS'd rig might look :cool: and all, you may not need it.

Look up some of Isaac's, aka AxleIke, and Scott's, aka JadeRunner, posts with what they have done trail wise with IFS rigs...Same can be said for the guys with 100 series rigs in the club. Heck, Dave took his IFS mini truck on the Rubicon and did awesome :D

Then if you decide later that you really want to spend the :twocents: on a SAS setup check out Scotty's build above or look at Red Chili's and Terry's rigs for encouragement.

Or just sell the 4Runner and buy an 80 series :hill:

Air Randy
08-13-2010, 08:03 AM
Make a plan and start buying parts. Then some winter work on you SAS swap.

Or be like Dr. Schlegs: Buy stuff, stack it in your garage for 2 years, move it 3 times, throw it away, buy more stuff, repeat process :D

Red_Chili
08-13-2010, 08:41 AM
If you wanna wheel, and have the funds & skilz, screw IFS and never look back. Sorry, my opinion.

$3500-4500 if you fab it yourself and don't take shortcuts. More if you pay someone else. Or you can buy an 80, spend more (maybe a LOT), be comfy, not fit between the trees, and be a clone. LOL

Dr. Schlegs
08-13-2010, 09:02 AM
Or be like Dr. Schlegs: Buy stuff, stack it in your garage for 2 years, move it 3 times, throw it away, buy more stuff, repeat process :D

Ok that is correct, except for the throwing away part. It's all GOLD. Randy, is a man of action, not much time for talking. Just because I have enough Oil Filters to last me for 54,000's, 20 tubes of palladium, two sets of tunable rotors, an F engine, 32 ARB toggle switches, two York Compressors, a set of OME greasable shackles, and an 80 ARB locker sitting in the garage is no reason to be hating. :lmao:

leiniesred
08-13-2010, 11:19 AM
BobInDenver and I were talking last night about mini-truck build costs.

If you want bigger tires, it is $5000

Bigger tires $1000
lift kit to clear bigger tires $500
regear to compensate for bigger tires $1000
While you are re-gearing, might as well ARB those diffs. $2500

There ya go. tires are $5000 to do it right the first time.

Add an SAS on that, don't forget the high-steer, and moving the steering box, and the ram assist, and the bigger steering pump, and the oil pan to clear the front diff...yep. $10,000

Red_Chili
08-13-2010, 11:46 AM
If you pay others. I found it is cheaper to obtain the tools & skilz. Many advantages when the inevitable inconvenient break happens.

DaveInDenver
08-13-2010, 11:51 AM
If you want bigger tires, it is $5000
Yup, this is about right when I add up OME suspension, 33" tires, gears, Air Lockers, Total Chaos arm, etc. So your estimate of $10K to do SAS is probably not far off when you start running down all the solid axle stuff that needs to be done right. Other than having Christo and Robbie do my gears and lockers, it's all my blood and sweat.

The path to 33" is not difficult and with the SDORI ball joint spacers the performance isn't too bad. Like Jeff mentioned, that is what I ran through the Rubicon. So it's a matter of how much you want to invest in the hobby.

FWIW, not everyone has big bucks invested in their trucks. That $5,000 in SAS money has given me far more satisfaction in Tua Nitrogen/Icelantic Pilgrim/Scarpa SL M3/Santa Cruz Blur LT form than it could have ever doing those last 10% of motorized trails.

corsair23
08-13-2010, 12:48 PM
Or be like Dr. Schlegs: Buy stuff, stack it in your garage for 2 years, move it 3 times, throw it away, buy more stuff, repeat process :D

Hmmm...I knew there was a reason I liked Kevin...Seems we plan, buy, and store stuff in the same manner :hill:

My philosophy is you need to let parts and mods age on a shelf like a fine wine before they are ready :)

Dr. Schlegs
08-13-2010, 03:00 PM
A deal is a deal. Fram TG8A Oil Filters for $2.50.

Me :"Um . . . How many do you have?"
Clerk: "12"
Me: "Ok, I'll take all of them and can you look and see if any other stores have any left?"

AxleIke
08-15-2010, 04:23 PM
I have spent more time, money, and effort on my IFS than I care to admit. I think most here think I am a bit nuts and quite stupid for doing so, but I enjoy a challenge and like to try things off the beaten path.

A couple of things I can tell you:

You have an old vehicle, with old components. If you do decide to lift it, add in the cost of replacement ball joints, tie rods, tie rod ends, and maybe some idler arm bushings.

A skinny 33" tire is best for these suspensions. They are robust, but you MUST understand how to drive them. They are a factory system, and have their weaknesses: if you learn them, you will be okay. I'm happy to discuss with you my experiences sometime if you wish.

All that being said, if you plan to run this truck fairly hard off road, and/or like big tires, you should do the SAS. Running IFS hard requires more maintenance, and patience, than most sane people have. (I wouldn't consider myself particularly sane at this point).

Many in this club run SAS runners and trucks, and I have heard VERY good things about them.

Couple of things I'll point out:

1. A traditional leaf spring swap is somewhat high for short statured folks; kids, for an example. In order to clear the steering, you need ~3" of lift. If you plan on DDing/running kids around, keep that in mind. You may have to do a bit of lifting.

2. The cost up front is a bit intimidating. However, consider that I've spent easily that on my IFS over time, likely more. The cost will get you either way.

3. For moderate trail running, DDing, and camping duties, the IFS will serve VERY well. Keep the front suspension in relatively stock form, and you will be just fine. Remember, a 33x10.5" tire on a stock back spaced rim will fit in the front of these trucks by simply folding the pinch weld over. Ball joint spacers provide lift, but do not restrict travel, and thus you cannot fit any bigger tire under the truck, as the suspension and wheel compress to the very same spot regardless.

4. I have a biased opinion, but its how I did it, so take that with a grain of salt: I always advocate running the truck stock with a good set of stock sized tires for 2 or 3 years. Stock form forces you to rely soley on your wits. It can be a bit frazzling, but you will be glad of it later. I drove my truck for 4 years before doing anything to it. It did have steel bumpers but those were due to accident replacements before it was mine.

Other than that, I'm happy to discuss the ins and outs of IFS with you any time. I've mutated mine enough that I can at least give you a list of things NOT to do! :D

Cheers, and welcome!

Red_Chili
08-16-2010, 08:50 AM
Yeah, what HE said!! If you are closeto the south side and want a tour of what a leaf sas entails, just pm me. If you gots bux deluxe, consider a coilover. Number of good kits out there now. Fyi my estimate covered only what you asked for - a SAS.

leiniesred
08-16-2010, 09:57 AM
Isaac is dead on. I drove IFS for many many years. All my ball joints, a arm bushings, and tie rods were wasted and it was actually cheaper to SAS the truck at the point. Besides, I wanted 37s to keep up with jkimmel on the trail.

If you want 33s or less, leave it stock. If you want 35s and up and you are wearing out your tires funny 'cause your suspension is trashed, go SAS.

lilred4runner
08-16-2010, 11:29 AM
Thanks for the warm welcome.

Lets start with a little history. Lived in western WA most of my life (except the first 13 lived in NEBR. GO BIG RED) I bought this off the lot in the end of 95, 1 owner rig so I know the history and it has seen a lot in 222226 miles but none of it was wheeling. Wheeling sucks in Wa to many locked gates.

We have been in CO for about six months now and I almost didn't bring this ride down to CO, but I'm glad I did. This is not my DD and no kids at home so not to worried about mods. not sure if you seen my notes for our first trip but My wife (Ronda) probably will never be an extreme wheeler, we are going to start slow and go from their. after I make these mods I'm not planning on tire upgrades until the 31's wear out.

I would love to go with SAS but not yet, other things get my extra cash for now.