PDA

View Full Version : Brand New Rig, do we need to change/drop trails?


WyoCruiser
04-14-2011, 10:21 AM
Some background before our questions. When we registered in January, we had an FJ Cruiser with sliders. Just two days ago, we traded it in on a Tacoma 4x4 Crew Cab. We went from a 105.9 wheelbase with an overall length of 183 to a whopping 127 in. wheelbase and length of 208.
Biggie? We will not be able to have any sliders installed before we leave for Moab.

We are novice wheelers looking forward to meeting you all, helping out and enjoying the scenery.

Understanding that sh** happens just driving down the boulevard, we'd still like to keep her looking as new as possible.

Oh, my questions, given the above info.:
1. Should we request a change to our trail assignments? Thurs:We requested Chicken Corners(no problem), Fri: Fins & Things, Sat: Sevenmile Rim.
2. If any of these runs are a problem for our stock truck, what alternatives do you suggest?

Thanks for your help.

xodeuce
04-14-2011, 10:29 AM
Check out my thread asking some similar quesitons:
http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=14911

Synopsis: Long wheelbase = need sliders, expect scraping the hitch on Fins & Things.

Hulk
04-14-2011, 10:40 AM
You should be OK on Fins & Things. You can bypass Kenny's Climb at the end -- it may be hard to get on the slope w/o dragging your bumpers with all that length.

corsair23
04-14-2011, 10:59 AM
IMO your biggest concern will be rocker panels and dragging your butt :hill:

Even lifted (2.5") I drug the ass end of the LX all over on Fins. I don't recall any concerns about the rockers on Fins but I have sliders. With your length though, you'll want to really watch them as the expense to fix the rockers will make the cost of sliders look cheap. If you have a hitch on the rear that "should" protect the rear although the bumper corners could see abuse.

I've never been on Sevenmile Rim

As for alternatives...Of the trails I've run, the only one I can think of that might be a good alternative is Hells Revenge. I don't recall any rocker panel concerns on that trail and I think the only big obstacle left (tip over challenge) that we can do during CM has a bypass. Porcupine might be another trail if you are careful, but that was the first trail I ever ran and the first one I hit my sliders on (driver error) :)

Trails I've run are Porcupine, Poison Spider, Fins, Hells, Metal Masher, Wipe Out Hill, and Tip Toe Behind the Rocks

Inukshuk
04-14-2011, 11:00 AM
I'll be leading 7 Mile Sat. We ran it recently on the pre-run. When we go to Uranium Arch there is a place I dragged my trailer hitch pretty good. We also have a few up/down steps. Mostly there are not a lot of obstacles. Let me think about this some more and maybe some Taco folks will chime in. Its a fun run so hopefully it still works for you.

Totally stock you say?

MDH33
04-14-2011, 11:49 AM
I can't speak specifically about your rig and the trails you'll be on, but I can say that even driving my tall, short wheelbase 40, I've taken on body damage every year I've been to Moab, and I usually pick "easy" trails and drive conservatively. It's wheeling, and damage is part of the game I guess. If you can't lift and armor it, or you're going to be :mad: about body damage, I would reconsider. You can always come out and hitch rides with others on some of the more exciting trails. :thumb:

leiniesred
04-14-2011, 12:37 PM
I would venture that 7 mile is the most challenging trail on your list there. There are some good size steps near the beginning of the trail that might prove too close to your sills, but I'm not sure. Even though we just pre-ran a bunch of the trails including 7 mile Rim, after Easter Jeep Safari, the trails can change quite a bit! Some places are dug out more, some places are stacked high with rocks...

It would be tough to catch up to a group on an easier trail that you haven't already run. E-hill would technically have room for you, but they'll be hours ahead of you by the time you turn around on 7 mile rim. Frankly, I think the steps on e-hill are about the same size as the ones on 7 mile rim too.

Maybe you can work up a backup plan with someone in camp to go do some exploring together if 7 mile is a bit too big for your tastes? There are many trails in the same area as 7 mile rim that would prove fun with your 2011. 3D Jeep Trail is a soft surface roller coaster for example. If you have a ham radio and a map, you could keep tabs on the 7 mile rim crew and catch back up to them after they pass the Wipeout Hill obstacle.

If you choose to go exploring the area by yourself, be very careful. No one will know you are stuck, broken down, hurt, or lost out there!

Another bail out option would be to go explore the dirt roads, hiking and photographic opportunities in nearby Arches National Park.

WyoCruiser
04-15-2011, 11:00 AM
Thanks for all your input. As a result of your comments and after speaking with RockRunner last night, I've posted a thread on Mud(http://forum.ih8mud.com/trails-events-expeditions/475435-easy-roads-trails-during-cruise-moab-2011-a.html#post6542397). :cheers:

Inukshuk
04-15-2011, 11:59 AM
I read the MUD Post. I was already going to recommend that I err on the side of caution and advise against 7 Mile for you. It is hard for me to recall all the tough spots after driving it in a lifted, locked and armored 80, :) but I suspect you would drag the tail and have to be super careful about the rockers.
Other fun drives include the Dubinky Sand Dunes, Gemini Bridges, back road into Arches, and one of the "bottom" roads to the River.
Any of the easy rated trails in the Charles Wells book would be fine. Chicken corners will be fine (and fun and scenic - I'm leading it Friday and just pre-ran it). I have explored a lot around Moab and happy to share what I know.

Rzeppa
04-15-2011, 02:19 PM
I ran Fins & Things with Phil Simmons when he was in his bone-stock taco x-cab. Only issue was slight dragging of the underside of the rear bumper on some of the ledges. The only damage was some slight scratches to the chrome where you couldn't see it anyway. There were no spots whatsoever where he needed sliders. I have also led Chicken Corner a number of times. It is Subaru Grade. I can't speak to 7 mile as I haven't run it (It is a new trail this year), but if you have worries your trail leader can help spot you over difficult stuff. Over the years I have taken pride on spotting newbies in their bone stock rigs over stuff they didn't know they could do, with no damage to their rigs. You'd be surprised what a stock Toyota 4x4 can do!

:cheers:

Rock Dog
04-15-2011, 05:52 PM
I ran Fins & Things with Phil Simmons when he was in his bone-stock taco x-cab. Only issue was slight dragging of the underside of the rear bumper on some of the ledges. The only damage was some slight scratches to the chrome where you couldn't see it anyway. There were no spots whatsoever where he needed sliders. I have also led Chicken Corner a number of times. It is Subaru Grade. I can't speak to 7 mile as I haven't run it (It is a new trail this year), but if you have worries your trail leader can help spot you over difficult stuff. Over the years I have taken pride on spotting newbies in their bone stock rigs over stuff they didn't know they could do, with no damage to their rigs. You'd be surprised what a stock Toyota 4x4 can do!

:cheers:

Hello Jeff, i also ran with Phil, but he was quite experienced, and he did scape up his bumper pretty good... He said he did not care because he planned to replace them anyway (always had an awsome attitude)... All the trails have been getting more dug out over the years as well.. I used to be able to do the Widow Maker in the Runner... that is no longer the case, and my rig did not change..

As far as Fins and things, coming down several spots before crossing the road (the first section) were worse and had less forgiving places for a long wheel base then the second half.. As you are very familiar there are bypasses for many places, including Kenny's climb but several of the climbs after Kennys are tail draggers for longer rigs to get started on... I bring this up because they may be able to join after the first section (i have had to do this in the past because of CM business).. had a great time.

That said, ther are plenty of cool places and mellow trails to enjoy in the area. Several have been mentioned, but there is also Looking Glass road to the "dirt road" that is a back way to the needles overlook.. This is pretty cool and goes by several "cave communities" that i found facinating... If they come out and are nervous with any of the trails, more than likely they can ride with someone else (especially with so many more wagons coming nowadays). or find some other great rides. So much to explore, so little time :D:D

nicholas
04-20-2011, 11:09 AM
I'm in a similar situation, my armored 80 is in storage in IL, and we are in ID and will be attending CM in my wife's 80 which only has an ARB front bumper, OME J's front/rear, 315 cooper stt's, e-lockers and a factory hitch.

We're signed up for Th-porcupine, FRI-poison spider, and Sat-hells revenge. I haven't been on any of these trails so I don't know what to expect. I was planning on making some sliders with the help from a neighbor, but he's been too busy.

I also posted on the mud thread linked above. Do you think I should bail on some of these trails so my wife doesn't send me to the dog house with an expensive rocker panel repair bill after CM? If it was my 80 I wouldn't care as much.

Kipper
04-20-2011, 11:28 AM
I've run poison spider and hells revenge with 285's and J's in an 80 with no sliders and suffered no damage to the rockers. factory hitch got lots of use. Honestly of the trails you mention the biggest threat to rockers is definitely porcupine rim. There is one section that if you aren't careful, you'll crunch them, but there is an alternate line you can get around with. I have run that trail in a 4Runner with 32's and an FJ60 with 31's. The FJ60 actually did get a small dent in the rocker. But it only had a 2" lift and I wasn't careful at all driving that truck :) I think you'll be fine if you're careful in the 80 with 35's and J's.

nicholas
04-20-2011, 11:33 AM
Thanks Kipper, that's good to hear as $600-1000 for sliders isn't something we have in the budget with the recent head gasket job I just finished last week and a blown birf/ front axle job (in progress).:eek:

So there's a bypass or alternate line you take on porcupine? Hopefully the EJS didn't make any significant changes to the trails.

nakman
04-20-2011, 11:50 AM
..

So there's a bypass or alternate line you take on porcupine? Hopefully the EJS didn't make any significant changes to the trails.


There are two spots on Porcupine- one near the bottom where there's a small drop-off to the left, you have to hug the right bank and you'll be fine, if you get too far left you'll drop down and hang up on both axles.... hmm maybe I can find a picture of Romer doing that.. :D

the second spot is about mid way, you'll actually descend a little hill, through some trees, then the trial goes up and to the right. Hard right takes you to the bigger "step" obstacle, a little wider to the left is easier. both should be pretty obvious, I'd totally take your rig up there.

Kipper
04-20-2011, 11:57 AM
this guy is going up the middle that is most likely to get your rocker, you can see there is a line to his right you can also take that stock trucks will take typically:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_c0YFMn5aPc

but as you said, after EJS every year that section gets worse and worse.

Kipper
04-20-2011, 12:01 PM
this has the other section nakman is referring to:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXcOWz2LZRE

nicholas
04-20-2011, 12:33 PM
Thanks for the videos guys. I guess I'll just take my chances and take it easy. I wish I would have had time to switch the sliders from my 80 to the :Princess:'s before I moved.:banghead:

corsair23
04-20-2011, 12:49 PM
this has the other section nakman is referring to:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXcOWz2LZRE


I recognize that video :hill: - Kipper, pretty sure that was the year you hit your rocker in the 60.


Here are some videos of Poison Spider from 4 years ago (the kid's all time favorite for some reason):

http://youtu.be/arRi6NnsPd4

http://youtu.be/kmT9RtHEbto

http://youtu.be/oathfvj_2tQ


To the OP, IMO Porcupine Rim and Poison Spider are the two most likely trails for you to possibly hit a rocker panel on. With your lift, 315s, and being careful I think you'd be fine but...I've run Hells Revenge once (forgot the camcorder) and IIRC, other than the entrance to and exit from the trail, it was mostly level (abeit sometimes steep) up and down on slickrock. I don't even think Tip Over Challenge would cause any concerns if you chose to do the obstacle vs. hitting the bypass.

Rzeppa
04-21-2011, 01:13 PM
So there's a bypass or alternate line you take on porcupine?

When I lead Porcupine rim I always guide newbies in stock wagons up the far right hand side of the ledge in that first video. Never crunched anybody's rocker even on stock springs and 235s. The trick is just stay as far right as possible.

That's the ledge where I got the nickname "homeless guy". Long story. I was spotting a stock wagon (FJ62) up the ledge. Seriously, on any of these trails, if you have ANY reservations whatsoever we will spot you professionally and perfectly. We have been doing this a long time and take pride in making sure everyone has a great experience.

Caribou Sandstorm
04-21-2011, 05:17 PM
Elephant Hill also is great for stock rigs, packs a bunch of fun features and views with little to know bumper scraping. Great introduction trail when in a large and guided group. It will be the trail you remember best and talk about the most!

nicholas
04-24-2011, 02:14 PM
When I lead Porcupine rim I always guide newbies in stock wagons up the far right hand side of the ledge in that first video. Never crunched anybody's rocker even on stock springs and 235s. The trick is just stay as far right as possible.

That's the ledge where I got the nickname "homeless guy". Long story. I was spotting a stock wagon (FJ62) up the ledge. Seriously, on any of these trails, if you have ANY reservations whatsoever we will spot you professionally and perfectly. We have been doing this a long time and take pride in making sure everyone has a great experience.

Sounds great, I can't wait to meet everybody and run some trails. I've heard many great things about this event and we are looking forward to it.

FJBRADY
04-24-2011, 04:35 PM
That's the ledge where I got the nickname "homeless guy". Long story.

I have to hear this story!!!!!