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View Full Version : Ball and Claw Tech Help Needed


MountainGoat
06-07-2011, 05:17 PM
My 67 FJ40 :zilla: has begun to spew gear lube out the ds knuckle so I need to handle it. I did a lot of searching on mud and learned a little. I know this axle has bushings instead of axle seals. I have no idea how tough they may be to get out of (and back into) the axle tube. Apparently you have to ream the bushing to fit properly on the axle. There also appears to be some possibility of a certain seal that would work to replace the bushing, but mud isn't very clear on that (pun).

Anyway, $OR shows the bushings as being in stock (see part #70 in the diagram below):

http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/uploads/mountaingoat/birfs/B&C.gif

I talked to Mark of Mark's Offroad but he wasn't forthcoming with much info as I've never bought anything from him. It was kind of strange, but I reckon he could spend a lot of time giving free advice and subsequently starve to death. He does however sell rebuild kits for these axles sans bushings (which he says are obsolete).

I have a line on a 74 front axle that I could also get and rebuild to replace the old school axle. I just need to know if it is worthwhile to tear into the 67 axle, or will I likely hit a dead end on fixing it? I have rebuilt the front axle on my 80, replaced the birfs, trunnion bearings, etc. so I have a little experience at least.

Anybody have any experience with these axles? Perhaps I should just tear into the axle and see what's happening in there. I would prefer to rebuild the old axle and keep it stock if I have a decent shot at succeeding.

I only run 31/10.50s with no lift. I really like the old bastard the way it is.:hill:

wesintl
06-07-2011, 05:27 PM
I would just take it apart and clean it up. The regular drum brake rebuild kit is what you need. it's sans the giant brass bushings instead of the axle seal. I didn't replace my bushings. seems to be ok. I guess you could put the axle in there 52/53 and see how much play there is in the bushing. IIRC the bushing is the same as in inner hub on the later disk brake axles. I didn't check. Pulling them isn't anymore of a pita as it is pulling rear wheel bearings...

also brass bushing's aren't going to hold back the gear oil like the later inner axle seals. so i'd expect some backwoods goop. I don't think there is any way you can change out brass bushing for a later inner axle seal type of bushing. i've never read that on mud.

wesintl
06-07-2011, 06:46 PM
supposedly these are the same but i'm not 100% sure

http://www.marlincrawler.com/axle/front-axle-parts/front-service-parts/service-front-hilux/spindle-brass-axle-bushing

Rzeppa
06-08-2011, 01:57 PM
If they really are the same or close to the same as the bushing in the spindle, I have the SST that removes the bushing. I had to replace one of the bushings in the front spindle of my 76. I doubt that they are exactly the same though, because the spindle bushings have those crisscross grooves in them, which are fine for grease but would probably leak 90wt.

I know that Mark still runs ball and claw in that blue FJ45 you see him in everywhere, and he supposedly knows those old front ends really well. Like you said, he doesn't make any money giving free advice on the phone.

If I were you I would go ahead and tear into it and see what you find out before replacing the whole axle.

wesintl
06-08-2011, 04:04 PM
I doubt that they are exactly the same though, because the spindle bushings have those crisscross grooves in them,

The ball and claw axle bushings have crisscross grooves, At least my 64 did when I rebuilt it recently. It didn't have the spiral cut and the crisscross didn't go all the way though the bushing. It has to have some lubercation. Some of the early ones I've seen are spiral cut in the 25 section. I'd be interested to see what yours are. Defiantly possible mine were replaced at one time, who knows.


Check out this one dan

http://forum.ih8mud.com/fj25-owners-group/407895-reproduction-inner-outer-brass-axle-bushings.html

MountainGoat
06-09-2011, 08:58 AM
Interesting stuff. I guess I'll jump in and see what I have. I will probably end up getting a rebuild kit from Mark (mainly because he will likely then share his "trade secrets" more willingly). Jeff, if I need the SST I'll let you know. I'll post up some photos once I get in there. :hill:

Rzeppa
06-09-2011, 12:01 PM
The ball and claw axle bushings have crisscross grooves, At least my 64 did when I rebuilt it recently. It didn't have the spiral cut and the crisscross didn't go all the way though the bushing. It has to have some lubercation. Some of the early ones I've seen are spiral cut in the 25 section. I'd be interested to see what yours are. Defiantly possible mine were replaced at one time, who knows.


Check out this one dan

http://forum.ih8mud.com/fj25-owners-group/407895-reproduction-inner-outer-brass-axle-bushings.html

That was an interesting thread, and it will be interesting to find out what Dan finds when he tears it apart. The spiral grooves make a lot more sense than the crisscross ones - they would carry oil back toward the axle housing side so it doesn't go too much into the knuckle.