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PhatFJ
01-15-2012, 08:27 PM
What year 4runner had the best/strongest 5 speed tranny? What model was it?

Thanks

Caribou Sandstorm
01-15-2012, 10:02 PM
You could check the 120 series forum..But I think anything from 2003 up was great. No issues.

Mine is sitting in a junkyard in Denver, some where..Bet you could get it cheap.

Jacket
01-15-2012, 10:04 PM
Or are you asking about the 5 speed manual that the 3rd gen 4Runners had (like Yoder's)?

PhatFJ
01-15-2012, 11:22 PM
Or are you asking about the 5 speed manual that the 3rd gen 4Runners had (like Yoder's)?

No, sorry I was not more specific. I am thinking more about the 1st or 2nd gen's as they seem to be really affordable. I am looking at the possibility of doing the MB diesel conversion into something other than the 40.. It really likes the 5.7L and this is going to be more of an expedition rig, I want a bit more comfort and room..

Oh, and yes on the manual..

DaveInDenver
01-16-2012, 06:13 AM
Toyota used the R150F behind the 3.0L (3VZ) and 3.4L (5VZ) V6. Probably the strongest of the commonly available transmissions. Downside is the transfer case is chain driven.

The W56 is very common from behind the 22R-E. Upside is that the transfer is gear driven, more options for re-gearing and dual cases.

There is a R151F variant that was behind the 22R-ET turbos that has a lower first gear. This is the holy grail because it accepts the 23-spline gear-driven t-case. Rare as hen's teeth and so probably not worth the money someone's going to be asking for it.

All of them were behind Toyota diesels at some point, but AFAIK the current 1KD-FTV uses a A750 6-speed auto like what was in Chris' 4Runner or V160 6-speed stick like in Tacomas. The 2L-T diesel would have been in front of a W56 or G52 and the 1KZ-TE I think an R150 or W58 (similar to the W59 from the 3RZ-FE 4-cylinder in the Tacoma).

I believe the rule of thumb is the W56 good to about 250 lb-ft and the R150 to about 350. The 5VZ-FE made about 265 lb-ft and can be supercharged.

My guess is the W56 is going to be the easiest to adapt to something like an OM617 since there are off the shelf bellhousings for this.

http://www.4x4labs.com/products/diesel-conversions/om617w56/

But the R150 is somewhat stronger, just that you'll have to make the adapter. I think 4x4labs was going to make one, just never heard if it actually came out or not.

To your question:
W56 - Behind every 1985-1995 22R-E, Pickup or 4Runner (like a million of them)
R150F - Behind every 1988-2003 3.0L or 3.4L V6 Tacoma or 4Runner (maybe just 999,999 of them)
R151F - 1986 and 1987 Turbo Pickup (count on two hands the number in Denver)

There is at least one exception to this, the G58 /might/ be found in a 22R-E that had the ADD front axle. This is pretty uncommon, though. I'm pretty sure that you'd have had to special order a 4 cylinder truck without manual hubs.

PhatFJ
01-16-2012, 07:49 AM
Toyota used the R150F behind the 3.0L (3VZ) and 3.4L (5VZ) V6. Probably the strongest of the commonly available transmissions. Downside is the transfer case is chain driven.

The W56 is very common from behind the 22R-E. Upside is that the transfer is gear driven, more options for re-gearing and dual cases.

There is a R151F variant that was behind the 22R-ET turbos that has a lower first gear. This is the holy grail because it accepts the 23-spline gear-driven t-case. Rare as hen's teeth and so probably not worth the money someone's going to be asking for it.

All of them were behind Toyota diesels at some point, but AFAIK the current 1KD-FTV uses a A750 6-speed auto like what was in Chris' 4Runner or V160 6-speed stick like in Tacomas. The 2L-T diesel would have been in front of a W56 or G52 and the 1KZ-TE I think an R150 or W58 (similar to the W59 from the 3RZ-FE 4-cylinder in the Tacoma).

I believe the rule of thumb is the W56 good to about 250 lb-ft and the R150 to about 350. The 5VZ-FE made about 265 lb-ft and can be supercharged.

My guess is the W56 is going to be the easiest to adapt to something like an OM617 since there are off the shelf bellhousings for this.

http://www.4x4labs.com/products/diesel-conversions/om617w56/

But the R150 is somewhat stronger, just that you'll have to make the adapter. I think 4x4labs was going to make one, just never heard if it actually came out or not.

To your question:
W56 - Behind every 1985-1995 22R-E, Pickup or 4Runner (like a million of them)
R150F - Behind every 1988-2003 3.0L or 3.4L V6 Tacoma or 4Runner (maybe just 999,999 of them)
R151F - 1986 and 1987 Turbo Pickup (count on two hands the number in Denver)

There is at least one exception to this, the G58 /might/ be found in a 22R-E that had the ADD front axle. This is pretty uncommon, though. I'm pretty sure that you'd have had to special order a 4 cylinder truck without manual hubs.

WOW Dave, A wealth of information and exactly what I was looking for. Thank you so much!! I really appreciate it!! :bowdown:

Brian

DaveInDenver
01-16-2012, 08:01 AM
Let me know how the swap goes, very interested. For a while I've been thinking that a 2L-T/2L-TE swap would be nice but it's not as cheap or easy as you'd think. So my if-Terry-wins-Powerball-and-gives-me-a-million plan is either an OM617 or one of the 1.9L VW TDI variants. Both of them have easy ways to retain the W56 I have in my truck already. I'd really like to put a 1KZ-TE in my truck, but those are not common and it's really no easier to swap than any other engine in that the mounts, wiring and stuff have to be moved so I might as well stick with an US EPA recognized engine that NAPA would have parts for.

subzali
01-16-2012, 08:50 AM
Dave, you need to get with DanS on this forum - he has a 2LT-E in his truck:
http://forum.ih8mud.com/79-95-toyota-truck-tech/157712-91-pickup-diesel-conversion.html

PhatFJ
01-16-2012, 09:14 AM
Let me know how the swap goes, very interested. For a while I've been thinking that a 2L-T/2L-TE swap would be nice but it's not as cheap or easy as you'd think. So my if-Terry-wins-Powerball-and-gives-me-a-million plan is either an OM617 or one of the 1.9L VW TDI variants. Both of them have easy ways to retain the W56 I have in my truck already. I'd really like to put a 1KZ-TE in my truck, but those are not common and it's really no easier to swap than any other engine in that the mounts, wiring and stuff have to be moved so I might as well stick with an US EPA recognized engine that NAPA would have parts for.

Dave, I will get a thread started once I decide which way I go..


Dave, you need to get with DanS on this forum - he has a 2LT-E in his truck:
http://forum.ih8mud.com/79-95-toyota-truck-tech/157712-91-pickup-diesel-conversion.html

This is a nice rig! I did Fins with he and his father last year..

DaveInDenver
01-16-2012, 09:18 AM
Dave, you need to get with DanS on this forum - he has a 2LT-E in his truck:
http://forum.ih8mud.com/79-95-toyota-truck-tech/157712-91-pickup-diesel-conversion.html
I know he does. We got a few 2L engines here but you don't exactly trip over them in junk yards. Not to mention they share the 22R-E slowness with the 3VZ-FE propensity for head issues. IMO not worth swapping in unless you can find one really cheap. Since it's my only truck and daily driver, converting it to EFI would be nice and we got zero of those (2L-TE) here, the swap becomes less attractive just to save not re-welding motor mounts. I'd prefer not to be one of a dozen trying to find parts for the EFI conversion of an engine we only got a few thousand of in the first place and have my truck dead in the water for 2 weeks waiting for something to come from Japan or Oz or maybe Canada.

subzali
01-16-2012, 09:35 AM
Oops, sorry Dave, didn't read your whole post. I thought you were leaning towards a 2L swap at first, but it's clear you're not. I know Dan frets a little about the head gasket, and I know that definitely is bothersome in my mind as well.

AxleIke
01-16-2012, 09:47 AM
Dave is correct, though the R151F is the strongest you can get. Just so happens I have one. The R150 is going to be your best bet if you don't want mine. Strong, common, and has a newer syncro design that makes it shift easier.

DaveInDenver
01-16-2012, 10:00 AM
Another option if someone wants the relative ease of adapting and geared t-case of the W56 is to have Marlin build a W56HD, which is closer to equivalent to a R150F and probably good enough in 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th. The R150 is superior to any G or W series tranny simply because of the 5th gear bearing issue (the R uses a bearing on each side of 5th, where the G and W only have a single bearing supporting 5th). The R transmission uses a larger diameter shafts, larger gears and heavier case, so even a W56HD isn't close to the same as an R150, but at least the bearings and input shaft are close and W56 have lived behind mild small blocks if you don't abuse them.

Red_Chili
01-17-2012, 12:18 PM
Dave is correct, though the R151F is the strongest you can get. Just so happens I have one. The R150 is going to be your best bet if you don't want mine. Strong, common, and has a newer syncro design that makes it shift easier.
I run an R151 behind my blown 5VZ in the Chili. It is a fine tranny but... that big heavy first gear makes shifting... leisurely, shall we say? It's OK but there have been times when I have thought VERY seriously about adding some stinky Ford Friction Modifier to the trans oil. This is even with MT-90.

AFAIK, the R151 and R150 are internally the same actually... aside from the newer synchros which are DEFINITELY worth it. Feels like a whole different transmission. It is more than the synchro design itself, because I used the newest R151/150 synchros I could find when I rebuilt mine.

If you found a 151 rear case and adapted that to a newer R150 you'd have a sweet config that would bolt right up to a gear transfer case. Good luck finding what you need though **. The V6 adapter plate from Marlin or A&A will get you where you need to be.

If I had it to do over again, I would have unhesitatingly gone with a newer R150 over the older R151/R150 design.

**caveat: I have not heard of this being done successfully, but certainly noted the similarity when overhauling my 151 and the thought bounced around my cranium like an unfortunately aimed .22LR. Probably with the same effect, if you consult some people. :lmao:

PhatFJ
01-17-2012, 12:23 PM
Thanks guys!!! :thumb: I really appreciate the input as always!!