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TheDoc
09-08-2013, 12:35 PM
New to wheeling in CO. Just purchased a 94 FZJ80. Need some legit tires for our rocky terrain. I have a 2-3 lift. Currently running 285/75/16. I would like to stay with that size... I think I have plenty of clearance for the type of cruisin I will be doing so I do not really want to go to 35". Cant justify paying $300+ for Toyos. I have heard mixed opinions on the BFG KM2s... Debating the Goodyear DuraTrac ($223 each) or MT/R Kevlar ($270 each). I'm worried about sidewall strength. Is the kevlar worth it? Any other tires with longstanding success that I should be considering. I just want a strong, reliable all around "aggressive" off-road tire. This will not be my daily driver. However, I will be driving it on road occasionally for fun and of course on the road to and from trails near and far. I appreciate your advice!

Caribou Sandstorm
09-08-2013, 12:52 PM
New to wheeling in CO. Just purchased a 94 FJZ80. Need some legit tires for our rocky terrain. I have a 2-3 lift. Currently running 285/75/16. I would like to stay with that size... I think I have plenty of clearance for the type of cruisin I will be doing so I do not really want to go to 35". Cant justify paying $300+ for Toyos. I have heard mixed opinions on the BFG KM2s... Debating the Goodyear DuraTrac ($223 each) or MT/R Kevlar ($270 each). I'm worried about sidewall strength. Is the kevlar worth it? Any other tires with longstanding success that I should be considering. I just want a strong, reliable all around "aggressive" off-road tire. This will not be my daily driver. However, I will be driving it on road occasionally for fun and of course on the road to and from trails near and far. I appreciate your advice!

DuraTracs probably the best and most widely used for both everyday Colorado driving and your weekend trips off the pavement. KM2s are tried and true, but I think the DuraTracs do better in the snow and actually grip better off road. The MT/Rs don't balance well, not a lot of great feedback on those.

I am running Maxxis BigHorns, and have to admit they are not the best for snow but I love the look and off road capability. So I drive more careful int he snow and talk louder on the cell phone, lol.

TheDoc
09-08-2013, 01:09 PM
Thanks Chris! Those are nice looking tires. When you need your next set are you sticking with the Bighorns?

You find some wheels for your trailer? I hope my post on your WTB thread is not viewed as thread jacking. I'm new to the forum stuff so if I violated any etiquette on that one I'll delete my post. If you get bombarded with offers for 16" 80 series wheels and you get what you need, let them know you know someone looking for wheels.

Thanks!

MountainGoat
09-08-2013, 02:18 PM
Hey Matt! I have run BFG KM and Cooper STT tires on my 80 recently. Prior to that I ran Interco Trxus Muds. The Interco tires do everything extremely well except for tread wear. They are pretty much done at around 30K. The KMs do great off road, but they have to be siped to work on the road in the winter. And they have terrible lateral traction for snow wheeling. I really like the Coopers I have on now, although I haven't driven them in the snow yet.

I have the Duratracs on one of my 4Runners and they are great. They have taken everything I've thrown at them, but I haven't run them in the snow yet either. I haven't read a bad review on either the Duratracs or STTs as far as winter driving, so I would think either of these would be great. The MTRs are just too damn pricey for me.

smslavin
09-08-2013, 02:37 PM
I'm a huge of fan of Nitto's Trail Grapplers. They handle pavement (wet or dry) well albeit with a bit of a hum and they are fantastic in the dirt. I've done a 5 tire rotation with them every 5k and I'm close to 40k on them. There's probably another 10-15k left in them. No issues with them in the snow.

Something slightly less aggressive, but just as capable, are the Terra Grapplers. A little better manners on pavement but definitely no slouch in the dirt. I'll be throwing a set on my wife's Sequoia in the next month or so.

Corbet
09-08-2013, 07:46 PM
The only weak point of the Duratrac is the sidewall IMO. They are very thin but despite that there have not been too many reports of failure. I have a set studded for winter use.

I have been happy with my Generals (red labels) but I don't run them in the winter. They are sticky on the rocks and quiet on the HWY for what they are. Sidewalls are very stout. Weak points would be tread wear & winter.

Previously I had the Nitto TG's which were good year round. I'd buy those again for a year round application. Plus they are available in a 295 which gives you just a little more without the drawbacks to 315's.

I had BFG AT's on my 60 and hated them.

TonkaToy
09-08-2013, 09:37 PM
I've always been a fan of mud tires, running KM2s on the 40 now, but on road ice/snow, no bueno! Then, I found out about siping and I'm a huge fan. Solved my on road issues, even helps with rain driving. It really helps those things grab that Moab slick rock too!
I bought some Cooper Discoverer AT's for my latest project but they are brand new and I've never driven them before. If they don't give me what I need, I won't hesitate to have those suckers siped too! I've been told it reduces mileage but its not a daily driver so that's not a concern for me.

jps8460
09-08-2013, 09:37 PM
I 2nd the Nitto terragrapplers, I've had them on my 60 for a year now and have no complaints. they are a 50,000 mile tire that has great all terrain and road condition traction.

Inukshuk
09-08-2013, 09:47 PM
Don't forget to search the old tire threads. This has been discussed extensively. (PS. very happy with my duratracs)

Hulk
09-09-2013, 12:03 AM
I have the Cooper STT tires on my 80 and they've been great.

MisledYouth
09-09-2013, 08:07 AM
I've got MT/R Kevlars on my 40, and Duratracs on my 100. I am thoroughly impressed with both tires. If you're going to stay with a 285/75r16, I'd go with the Duratracs. Mine are load range E (10 ply), while my MT/R-K's are load range D (8 ply). I've sufficiently stabbed both sidewalls, and have some good road miles on both sets. Either is a good choice, but I would try the Duratracs first.

Duratracs at Radical Hill
http://i1269.photobucket.com/albums/jj589/zacharyfeiler/DSC_9086.jpg (http://s1269.photobucket.com/user/zacharyfeiler/media/DSC_9086.jpg.html)

MT/R-K posing
http://i1269.photobucket.com/albums/jj589/zacharyfeiler/40.jpg (http://s1269.photobucket.com/user/zacharyfeiler/media/40.jpg.html)

Caribou Sandstorm
09-09-2013, 10:04 AM
Thanks Chris! Those are nice looking tires. When you need your next set are you sticking with the Bighorns?

You find some wheels for your trailer? I hope my post on your WTB thread is not viewed as thread jacking. I'm new to the forum stuff so if I violated any etiquette on that one I'll delete my post. If you get bombarded with offers for 16" 80 series wheels and you get what you need, let them know you know someone looking for wheels.

Thanks!

Hi Matt,

Welcome to the Rising Sun forum, also! No worries on posting here, we are a bit more laid back than some other sites.

I am good on wheels, we were able to find a hub adapter to go from 5 on 5 to 5 on 150mm, so able to use 2 100 series wheels to match my LC. Thanks Tim for breaking up your set!!

Also, I am actually sticking with the Bighorns again. Since I need 2 trailer wheels and I want them to match, so I only carry one spare, I am buying 3 new Bighorns and with new spare will have 4 new tires.

Kind of thinking of having the inner tread siped. I think that makes them wear a bit faster but might make a real difference in the snow.

Rzeppa
09-09-2013, 06:07 PM
I ran 33 x 10.5 BFG M/Ts and M/T KMs on all my Land Cruisers for years and years, and they were fine as long as you siped them. No siping and you will have major scary issues in ice, snow and even wet pavement. I tore a sidewall pretty bad on Hackett Rock some years ago, but other than that they were good tires as long as they were siped.

When they came out with the KM2s and I needed new tires for my 60 I started looking around and a lot of people were saying good things about the Duratracs. I put a set of 285/75R16s on and couldn't be more pleased. They do great in snow, ice and wet pavement, stick like crazy glue on the rocks, go fine in mud and are surprisingly quiet on the highway for how aggressive the tread is.

When I first got them I was unsure about the sidewall, they really seem to bulge more than I am used to, and at first I was a bit afraid to air them down much. I have had them on for over a year and a half and have learned that they aren't "thin" just flexy, and that's a good thing. Better traction and fuel economy. But they aren't thin or weak compared to other tires that don't bulge as much, it's all in their high-tech rubber compound. I air down to 17 PSI now and have wheeled the snot out of them, never had any issues with sidewalls. In fact, my rims haven't even gotten as dinged up as the rims have when I ran the BFGs.

AxleIke
09-09-2013, 10:17 PM
The only weak point of the Duratrac is the sidewall IMO. They are very thin but despite that there have not been too many reports of failure. I have a set studded for winter use.

I have been happy with my Generals (red labels) but I don't run them in the winter. They are sticky on the rocks and quiet on the HWY for what they are. Sidewalls are very stout. Weak points would be tread wear & winter.

Previously I had the Nitto TG's which were good year round. I'd buy those again for a year round application. Plus they are available in a 295 which gives you just a little more without the drawbacks to 315's.

I had BFG AT's on my 60 and hated them.


What size are you running? I had always thought that they were all thin, 2ply stuff, but then someone on Expo showed a set of em in the 285 range and they were 3 ply. Someone said below that size they were only 2. No idea if any of that is true. Just curious.

Inukshuk
09-09-2013, 10:30 PM
When I first got them I was unsure about the sidewall, they really seem to bulge more than I am used to, and at first I was a bit afraid to air them down much. I have had them on for over a year and a half and have learned that they aren't "thin" just flexy, and that's a good thing. Better traction and fuel economy. But they aren't thin or weak compared to other tires that don't bulge as much, it's all in their high-tech rubber compound. I air down to 17 PSI now and have wheeled the snot out of them, never had any issues with sidewalls. In fact, my rims haven't even gotten as dinged up as the rims have when I ran the BFGs.

After the Ouray trip and major rocks on Tincup Pass I can't even hardly see a scuff mark on my Duratrac sidewalls. Only sidewall I ever cut was to a nearly new Nitto TG on Chicken Corners.

TheDoc
09-10-2013, 12:49 AM
I am really appreciating all the comments. My tire purchase will likely exceed $1200... especially if I buy a matching spare. So, this is an important decision.

Seems like the following are all respected tires:
Duratracs
General "Red Label"Grabbers
Nitto "TG" -- I assume we are talking Trail Grappler M/T not Terra Grappler AT
Cooper STT

Guess I'll just have to get one of each ;)

Decisions, decisions... Just need a new set by 10/19 for the spooky run.

Thanks everyone!

Corbet
09-10-2013, 07:56 AM
What size are you running? I had always thought that they were all thin, 2ply stuff, but then someone on Expo showed a set of em in the 285 range and they were 3 ply. Someone said below that size they were only 2. No idea if any of that is true. Just curious.

Mine are 315's. They are "E" rated. I can't speak for other sizes personally. Mine felt extremely thin when I got them. (ordered from Summit Racing). When I had them mounted the tire tech even committed they seemed super thin in the sidewall for what they are. Later I spoke with a local GoodYear dealer down here. They had quit selling them to the oil & gas guys as they had so many sidewall failures locally. Personally all this does not matter to me. Mine only see the HWY for the most part as they have studs for winter use.

Corbet
09-10-2013, 07:59 AM
Nitto "TG" -- I assume we are talking Trail Grappler M/T not Terra Grappler AT


I was talking about the Terra Grappler and I believe most others are too. The Trail Grappler is much newer in the line and not many in the club have run them yet to my knowledge. The folks I know with them like the tire though.

rockrod
09-10-2013, 08:08 AM
I traded a guy for my old set of 315 KM2s for a set of 285 coopers. I couldn't be happier. I have wheeled the coopers 3 times now and they have worked great. They ride great and are very quiet. The km2s did not.

smslavin
09-10-2013, 09:00 AM
I was talking about the Terra Grappler and I believe most others are too. The Trail Grappler is much newer in the line and not many in the club have run them yet to my knowledge. The folks I know with them like the tire though.

I have the Trail version. Absolutely love them. Wifey will bet getting Terras on the Sequoia in about a month.

nakman
09-10-2013, 11:39 AM
I think Nitto Trail Grappler will be my next tire. Currently running Duratracs, which are the best tire I've ever had on snowy I-70 conditions. But alas yes, I did rip a sidewall on one wheeling. We'll see what else comes out in the next couple years though, as mine are essentially new.

And we should always have at least one active tire thread, thanks for posting! :cheers:

Caribou Sandstorm
09-10-2013, 01:02 PM
I think Nitto Trail Grappler will be my next tire. Currently running Duratracs, which are the best tire I've ever had on snowy I-70 conditions. But alas yes, I did rip a sidewall on one wheeling. We'll see what else comes out in the next couple years though, as mine are essentially new.

And we should always have at least one active tire thread, thanks for posting! :cheers:

That is a nice tire Tim.

If you had 17 inch rims you could get it in a 34" and the width is under 12".

That is almost the height of a 315 at a half inch narrower.

I keep thinking a 17" rim is the way to go, down the road. For just this reason.

AxleIke
09-10-2013, 01:26 PM
Mine are 315's. They are "E" rated. I can't speak for other sizes personally. Mine felt extremely thin when I got them. (ordered from Summit Racing). When I had them mounted the tire tech even committed they seemed super thin in the sidewall for what they are. Later I spoke with a local GoodYear dealer down here. They had quit selling them to the oil & gas guys as they had so many sidewall failures locally. Personally all this does not matter to me. Mine only see the HWY for the most part as they have studs for winter use.

Good to know! I had considered them before I got a great deal on my current tires, so I never looked further. I'll keep that in mind for future use.

drtire
09-10-2013, 04:34 PM
I;m new but I design tires and wheels. the tire side is full of compromises. the duratrac is what is called a tweener tire. not a mud and not an AT. cooper has one, procomp, and goodyear that's about it. for durability I take the trxus MT any day works as advertised I know I helped design it. it is now built by STA and not denmen. so it will last longer but .... just a little longer. compromise is the key. you must balance your needs to performance. the duratrac is probably the best for you but folks have found out weak sidewalls. the Interco Trxus MT out performs it with the exception of mileage. so you have to make the decision. there are reasons why each tire works but that isn't what is important. its what is important to you. any feel free to ask.
has anyone seen the birddog wheel?

drtire
09-10-2013, 04:46 PM
I am new to your form. that being said I am a registered member so I can gather information on tires and wheels. because that is what I do for Interco tire co. go to the Interco tire web site or facebook and look up Birddog wheels. that is a product created by the needs of people like you. this a rare occurrence to have an actual representative of a tire/wheel company listen to the people that use it's products. the Birddog wheel is a prime example of what can happen if a company listens to its users. so at any time you see the need or just have a question. i'll do my best to answer it.
in the mean time keep your wheels down and top up, good wheeling.
Dennis Franklin

CardinalFJ60
09-10-2013, 04:50 PM
The only weak point of the Duratrac is the sidewall IMO. They are very thin but despite that there have not been too many reports of failure. .

I don't run these, but I'll tell you, I've seen sidewall and tread puncture 100% of the time when wheelin' with a fellow 60 owner who has them in 16". (OK, 2 runs...but both times) I'm sure it's coincidence as most I've talked to love them.

but wait...how many sidewall punctures/failures have you guys have with Duratracs compared with your other tires? (knocking on wood...I've never had a puncture with my BFGs)

I've been running BFG ATs and MT (km2). the only reason I moved away from the AT was one time, in MT they loaded up so much mud it was crazy!...like an inch off the tread!:eek: I've been happy with the KM2s. That said...the ATs for me were GREAT for on/off road duty and worked well for me in the snow. (as they get older, they get much worse in the snow/cold)

Corbet
09-10-2013, 05:12 PM
I am new to your form. that being said I am a registered member so I can gather information on tires and wheels. because that is what I do for Interco tire co.

I want a 36"x11.5"R16 MT type tire with a stout sidewall and at least 21/32" of tread with a decent tread life (better than TrXus) If nothing like that appears my next set of tires will be toyo MT's

simps80
09-10-2013, 05:20 PM
but wait...how many sidewall punctures/failures have you guys have with Duratracs compared with your other tires? (knocking on wood...I've never had a puncture with my BFGs)



i haven't pierced a sidewall with my duratracs, but I have noticed they don't need aired down a lot...

I've seen people on mud complain about this with duratracs and the one's that I remember that have been serious about investigating it had D load rated tires instead of the 10-ply E rated tires...

I'm sure there's plenty of E rated duratracs that have been punctured though..

its a compromise, but one worth it in my book for the performance in winter driving.

Fishy
09-10-2013, 06:56 PM
I've been very happy with the Trail Grapplers. I did cut one sidewall, but it actually didn't rip all the way through and still held air. They've taken a pretty good beating and held up well. You can see a lot of marks/rubs on them that held strong. My BFG's chunked really bad where these do not.

I'm going to sipe them in a few weeks in preparation for winter though.

nakman
09-10-2013, 07:02 PM
Welcome drtire.. my experience with Trxus MT was they wheeled great, and were fun in deep snow. But they wouldn't balance well, wore fast, and were very loud. Had to put close to a pound of weight on a couple of them, even rotate the rim inside the tire a couple times to balance out the high spots..

I went from Trxus to Toyos and gave up some of the offroad grip action, also likely lost a little snowy road traction. But they actually balanced and rolled well, which was a huge upgrade. At the time I swore I'd never get Trxus again, because they balanced so poorly. this was probably 6 years ago, has anything changed?


And I don't get what you guys are saying about E rated being stronger- my Duratracs are E-rated and it says right on the sidewall there's 2 ply. Yes, the tire I ripped was E rated.

Fishy
09-10-2013, 07:12 PM
And I don't get what you guys are saying about E rated being stronger- my Duratracs are E-rated and it says right on the sidewall there's 2 ply. Yes, the tire I ripped was E rated.

^^Same

http://i1216.photobucket.com/albums/dd364/coflytyer/D7K_1984_zpsfb9805fc.jpg (http://s1216.photobucket.com/user/coflytyer/media/D7K_1984_zpsfb9805fc.jpg.html)

simps80
09-10-2013, 07:14 PM
And I don't get what you guys are saying about E rated being stronger- my Duratracs are E-rated and it says right on the sidewall there's 2 ply. Yes, the tire I ripped was E rated.

10 ply is a rating..E equals 10 ply. A rating of strength and load capacity..not actually number of plys.
So your e rated 10ply are stronger than the 8 ply d rated tires.

"
Ply ratings identify the load carrying capabilities of a tire in terms of plies. Ply rating originally referred to the number of cotton layers used to strengthen a tire's casing. Today, when tires are labeled 10-ply, they are not actually constructed of 10 individual layers of cotton, but offer the equivalent strength. Passenger tires are currently constructed from one or two body plies, while light truck tires consist of two to three, or one steel ply. Over time, steel ply and radial construction replaced cotton leading to a new distinction, load range."

nakman
09-10-2013, 07:18 PM
10 ply is a rating..E equals 10 ply. A rating of strength and load capacity..not actually number of plys.
So your e rated 10ply are stronger than the 8 ply d rated tires.

"
Ply ratings identify the load carrying capabilities of a tire in terms of plies. Ply rating originally referred to the number of cotton layers used to strengthen a tire's casing. Today, when tires are labeled 10-ply, they are not actually constructed of 10 individual layers of cotton, but offer the equivalent strength. Passenger tires are currently constructed from one or two body plies, while light truck tires consist of two to three, or one steel ply. Over time, steel ply and radial construction replaced cotton leading to a new distinction, load range."

So what does the ply=2 info on the sidewall mean? 2 layers of 5 each? :confused:

Ok, read it again. So 10 ply doesn't actual imply 10 ply.. just more than 8. thanks for clearing that up! :)

Caribou Sandstorm
09-10-2013, 07:37 PM
Good readin' right here!

I like tires and tire stuff... I could read about tires and Sceptor/Nato cans all day long..

CardinalFJ60
09-10-2013, 10:43 PM
:thumb: Oh sorry, back to tires...

nakman
09-12-2013, 09:49 PM
Bummer. Was hoping for more than the "seagull" response from Interco... Thought this could have turned into something. Guess not?