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CardinalFJ60
06-02-2014, 12:29 PM
I'm starting to research orange bikes for myself. the short story is my 8 year old's best friend and Dad hit the track most weekends and I envision trail riding in Utah and around here as well.

Would the Enduro's be comfortable on both trail and track? Would you recommend something 450 or smaller for that dual purpose? Am I overthinking?

Is there I big difference between the SX and EXC? (other than lights and horn)

Jacket
06-02-2014, 01:47 PM
There are probably a lot of subtle differences between the MX and Trail bikes that would go unnoticed by a newer rider. But in general the SX is tuned to be a track bike. Lightweight, close ratio transmission, 5 speed tranny (I think), smaller gas tank and nothing for street use. EXC is at the other end of the spectrum being an enduro bike. E-start with added weight items like battery and stator, wide ratio tranny, 6 speed, and bigger gas tank (although many/most EXC riders end up going with a bigger aftermarket tank). And with an EXC you get some of the streetable stuff like lights and a horn. For KTM, there are also XC and XCW varieties that fall somewhere in between the above two. I think Farnham's is an XCW.

If you want to be able to do both track and trail, I think getting an EXC or XCW is advisable so that you can relatively easily get a license plate for it. In Colorado you often have to ride pavement and county roads to string trails together, so having a plate eliminates the worry of connecting on a county road.

I feel like the 450 is the best balance of weight and power, and a great all around bike in the 4 stroke variety. But a 400, 450 or 525 is pretty close to the same bike, with minor size differences in the engine, so all of those would be good sizes. 600+ is too big IMHO unless you are doing more pure enduro and XC type riding. You could also consider a 300, which is a large two stroke. VERY powerful and fun, easily streetable, but you have to carry your oil with you on longer trips. And you have to do top end rebuilds fairly often. 4 strokes are more like your trucks - put gas in the tank and change the oil often. You'll need to adjust the valves periodically, but other than that you get 1000's of miles of low maintenance fun.

Jacket
06-02-2014, 01:54 PM
PS - We can head out to Erie (or somewhere free like the National Forest ;)) and you can try my bike if you like. I've got a 450 EXC, plus a CRF70 for the little one.

rover67
06-02-2014, 02:21 PM
450 4 stroke something would be good. My 525 feels big (even though it has the same everything as a 450.. just bigger bore) in the tight woods. It's gonna be hard to find something that crosses over from MX to street/dirt roads at all. If you want to ride the OHV areas/trails only you can get away with not having a plate and rocking a MX bike. If you see any paved/fast dirt road travel in your future a MX bike will suck. On the other hand you can take a EXC with a headlight and electric start and a squishy enduro suspension out onto an MX track you're gonna have to be careful not to ball it up. Doable and fun but you won't be out there begin super fast. It's gonna feel like a bigger bike with the wrong suspension. I never ride track so I'm fine with my big heavy EXC but I do occasionally wish for a 450 instead of the 525. Sure the power is nice but the rotating mass of the engine being greater really gives the bike a piggy character.

Get two bikes.

wesintl
06-02-2014, 02:29 PM
yamaha wr250r, agile, plenty of power.

rover67
06-02-2014, 02:37 PM
yamaha wr250r, agile, plenty of power.

that'd be a fun one for sure

subzali
06-02-2014, 02:48 PM
I found that stiffening up the damping on my bike helped on the jumps at the Berthoud harescramble, though a couple jumps were still a little rough. If you're doing a real motocross track with high doubles and triples then you need a track bike. In general though I would agree to get an xcw and make it work at the track rather than try to make a track bike work in the woods-the gearing will kill you until you are good with clutching and taking stuff at high speed. The 300 is a cool bike but you can't go more than about 60 miles before you have to fill up. My buddy is always worrying about gas and I never give it a second thought.

Go to the ktm demo day when it comes around and try them all for yourself :thumb:

CardinalFJ60
06-02-2014, 02:56 PM
I found that stiffening up the damping on my bike helped on the jumps at the Berthoud harescramble, though a couple jumps were still a little rough. If you're doing a real motocross track with high doubles and triples then you need a track bike. In general though I would agree to get an xcw and make it work at the track rather than try to make a track bike work in the woods. The 300 is a cool bike but you can't go more than about 60 miles before you have to top off. My buddy is always worrying about gas and I never give it a second thought.

Go to the ktm demo day when it comes around and try them all for yourself :thumb:

great advice you guys, thanks. I'm a COMPLETE novice on the dirt - it's totally different than street riding. I was tooling around with the 8 year olds on there 50s. But I got much better and faster as the day went on. I'm so hooked. I was on a brand new 450 sx-f. I don't know anything about KTM bikes 'cept that I rode it and didn't dump it.

I foresee doing both trails and track (track for fun and comradery with the neighbors since they go pretty often - not so much to get into racing). I like the advice of not trying to make a track bike trail worthy, but the other way around. are there adjustments you can make "on the fly" to make a bike more trail or track worthy?

subzali
06-02-2014, 02:59 PM
I changed my plastics in about 4 hours to get ready to race :guapo:

The suspension damping is about all you can do quickly. Take off your light, mirrors and license plate too maybe

J Kimmel
06-02-2014, 03:36 PM
I'm on a YZ 450 with a recluse for trails, its worked great. Getting a complete suspension re-valve was key. My plan is to get a 300 XCW in the spring and I will valve the suspension again in it a bit firmer so I can ride both :)

cruiseroutfit
06-03-2014, 01:26 AM
Fwiw I ride a 450 XCW. My 2 cents.

Perfectly suited for bombing trails in the open desert, fire roads and single track, yet a workable compromise on the track or road. I've honestly not done much track riding with this bike, enough to know that it is a heavy pig. That said if your not looking to compete and just want to rip it up on a bigger track, it will still be fun and great training. The road is a compromise as well, mine has a 'barely streetlegal' kit, basically enough to get a plate sans the req'd DOT tires. It's great for hopping between trails in say Moab, and the misses and I rally out to dinner from time to time but beyond that you really feel like your wringing its neck to do 65+ for more than a few minutes at a time and the handling isn't ideal at speed. Guys swap sprockets, drop the RPM's and install some more street freindly rubber and rip them around all over on the highway but I don't have the time, money and energy to swap tires/wheels for a weekend dirt trip and thus mine stays in it's current trim. Hope that helps.

CardinalFJ60
06-13-2014, 08:35 AM
here she is...2004 400 EXC with some goodies on it. auto-clutch, dampener, tubliss, and maybe some other things I haven't recognized in the pile of paperwork. Chasing down a couple street legal items now...small things like...the title:rolleyes:, mirror, horn - tires don't say DOT.

It's a little tall for me - need to dial in the suspension and maybe get a shorter seat. I'm short.

subzali
06-13-2014, 09:15 AM
Looks like it's been pretty well taken care of! I see you're already setup with a sweet moto carrier! Good work Shawn!

Cocarlisle
06-15-2014, 10:26 PM
450 ktm exc 2004 or newer will be great
It has a lower first gear for slow going and a taller 6th gear for comfortable cruising at 60 MPHs
The suspension on a ktm EXC or XCW is what you are after for sure
Any SX will beat you up and require new springs and a revalve for sure so stay away from any motocross oriented bike
Also any motocross bike (think ktm sx, yamaha yzf, honda crf will have a much taller first gear meaning you will have to learn to go over obstacles with lots of momentum and speed rather than crawling as the first gear is much higher and they only go about 50 Mph top speed at about 7000 rpms
Parts for KTMs are everywhere and they seldom need any work and the old RFS engines can go 40000 miles before requiring a new top end if taken care of
A ktm 450 or 525 from 2001 to 2007 are the landcruisers of motorcycles (these are the old rfs engines )
2008 are great but a bit harder to work on and the valves are a shim stack vs a traditional feeler gauge adjustment
I don't know landcruisers very well but know bikes for sure and ride with some of the fastest riders in the state (think almost pro but too old and International six day enduro guys)
I would get a 2004 to 2007 ktm exc or xcw 450 period nothing newer and nothing older unless it's a steal which doesn't exist in the world of KTMs
I have owned about 15 Ktms and you can't go wrong
Well now I have a Husaberg (ktm owned / this is the new Husqavarna) love it
Good luck

Cocarlisle
06-15-2014, 10:39 PM
Cardinal fj60
I have a front dot tire you could borrow
It's not mounted
Let me know
Nice 400 !!!!

subzali
06-16-2014, 08:07 AM
Cocarlisle, I was riding at Taylor last fall with a guy who was training for isde a little as well. Forget his name now but he basically spent every weekend of the summer at Taylor with his family. Do you know who I'm talking about?

Cocarlisle
06-19-2014, 10:38 PM
Jeremy showing