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View Full Version : Talk me out of a Heep...


timmbuck2
12-04-2006, 12:17 AM
OK, so I have always had a "fun" weekend car to drive to work on Friday and around town on the weekends....for years I had a 72 convertible and loved it. I drove a 2001 Wrangler for 2 years until I bought my first 80 last year, and there is no way I would go away from an 80 for my daily driver/offroad truck. However, I still crave that 'convertible' fun weekend vehicle. I would love a 40 to wrench on weekends and drive on sunny days with the top down, but I have been searching for over a year, and the timing is always wrong, or they change their mind then sell it to someone else 3 months later (you know who you are. :p: ) I am almost giving up on finding a drivable 40 project, but I can find tons of cheap Jeeps...parts are easy to find, relatively reliable, I would never take it anywhere tough off-road, that is for the 80. Am I crazy? Or just frustrated at finding a 40? Or just drunk again? ;)

T

:beer: :blah: :beer:

lfd270ben
12-04-2006, 01:17 AM
thats nonsense and I hope your excuse is you are drunk I picked my 40 up for 1400 from a farmer it ran great and didn't stop (well one wheel stopped but thats it) the joy I think is getting a turd and making it into something . Keep tryin you will find one. And dont say the j$$p word around here its just fowl!!!!

FJBen
12-04-2006, 08:45 AM
Or just drunk again? ;)

T

:beer: :blah: :beer:

I would guess drunk again....finding one is frustrating as all hell...I have never REALLY stopped looking for a 40...they are around...you just REALLY have to be ready to pull the trigger at any second to get one.

Pass on the Jeep...there's a reason you drive/like Land Cruisers...

subzali
12-04-2006, 11:04 AM
Everybody and his brother has a heep...be original. Count 'em...around here *almost* one vehicle in 20 is some sort of heep, not all CJs, YJs or TJs, but even those are pretty common. 40s look better anyway.

Take my friend, and I'll make this quick: Sept. 02 bought '81 CJ7 for $4200. Needed steering box but that was about it. Couple weeks later his engine developed a knock, and while they were inspecting it they found 3 of 9 front pinion teeth missing. Transmission didn't shift good. So they decided they had to rebuild the engine, main bearings were gone, so they ended up replacing the tranny and rebuilding the x-fer at the same time. Got it running by Nov. or so, he took it driving in 2wd around town then his rear end blew up on him! So he spent the rest of the winter swapping out front and rear axles to Dana 44. By Spring 03 he was driving again, but didn't like the carb so in summer 03 he got fuel injection. Then in fall 04 the body started showing MAJOR rust bubbles that had been covered up with a paint job. So he's talking about replacing the body/tub and he still doesn't like the power of the 258 so he's talking about swapping engines again. He's also still on 31 x 10.50's with 3.56 gearing and now he's got somewhere around $15 grand total in it.

My truck: bought in Jan 05 for $3500, drove back from GJ the day we bought it. Needed small stuff, fuel tank vent leak, exhaust leak, heater broke, no w/s washer assy, some other odds and ends, but ran pretty good etc. I've spent the last couple years working on mostly the little things, but the tranny, t-case, diffs and front axle either showed no signs of heavy wear/breakage, or just needed to be cleaned up and new seals, parts etc. I've spent a total of around $7 grand not including tires on my truck, and I have a heavier duty drivetrain and more body clearance than my buddy plus a rear locker.

Obviously the story could have been reversed, and his truck is still cleaner than mine, but I still think that I've gotten away for a pretty good deal considering mine's 30 years old and seems to have been somewhat neglected/unmaintained. Obviously a newer TJ is going to require less maintenance etc., and older 40s and heeps are going to necessarily require more maintenance time, or in my case, more time to bring the truck up to an acceptable level for normal regular operation, but that comes with a territory. But there's lots of guys here and on MUD that have found cleaner trucks than mine for about the same money; my dad and I were kinda looking for a running project truck that I could dink around with but that started out running and I could go bash in the woods. That's prolly more than :twocents:, but that's still my :twocents:

Nay
12-04-2006, 11:11 AM
OK, so I have always had a "fun" weekend car to drive to work on Friday and around town on the weekends....for years I had a 72 convertible and loved it. I drove a 2001 Wrangler for 2 years until I bought my first 80 last year, and there is no way I would go away from an 80 for my daily driver/offroad truck. However, I still crave that 'convertible' fun weekend vehicle. I would love a 40 to wrench on weekends and drive on sunny days with the top down, but I have been searching for over a year, and the timing is always wrong, or they change their mind then sell it to someone else 3 months later (you know who you are. :p: ) I am almost giving up on finding a drivable 40 project, but I can find tons of cheap Jeeps...parts are easy to find, relatively reliable, I would never take it anywhere tough off-road, that is for the 80. Am I crazy? Or just frustrated at finding a 40? Or just drunk again? ;)

T

:beer: :blah: :beer:

The only real problem with Wranglers is everybody has one. There isn't really any other downside except asking a Land Cruiser club what they think :D

Since you don't appear to want to modify it for offroad use, the question is whether you want a project (40) or just a soft top to drive (TJ). Personally, I'd need to be desperately in love with the 40 series to trade the conveniences of a late model vehicle for a true project. A TJ Rubicon is out of the box all you'd ever need, no wrenches required.

FJBen
12-04-2006, 11:31 AM
I think that is the best part of a 40...the fact you CAN love it. The Jeeps just lack soul...as do most new(ish) vehicles...you can't throw a dead hooker without hitting a Jeep in Greeley...

A 40 has soul, mojo, bondo, tetanus and possibly hanta-virus but thats why you love them...Old iron...how much wrenching do you need?

get the brakes working good, tune up the engine and just drive/love her!

Sometimes technology is bad...

timmbuck2
12-04-2006, 01:44 PM
...you can't throw a dead hooker without hitting a Jeep in Greeley...


speaking from experience????!!!!!

:eek: :eek: :eek:

FJBen
12-04-2006, 02:01 PM
speaking from experience????!!!!!

:eek: :eek: :eek:

of course...you've heard of dwarf tossing right? well in Greeley, we have the "hooker huck" :D

and I WHOLEHEARTEDLY agree on the CJ being POS...I had an 85....ran like **** with that crappy Carter BBD carb only had 112K. Blew the headgasket, frame was bent to ****, broke the rear axle (AMC20) with stock tires shifting gears at 25mph, put a nice 4.0L (actually the best upgrade but at a price $$$$) cheap thin body, felt REALLY wimpy compared to a cruiser...glad that only lasted a year:eek:

And mine actually looked really nice/clean :eek: run away...and Wrangler/TJ...good engine...99% have crappy axles...unless you want to spend 25K+ for a boobicon...

corsair23
12-04-2006, 02:42 PM
...I would love a 40 to wrench on weekends and drive on sunny days with the top down, but I have been searching for over a year...

You could always borrow my '74 FJ40 to wrench on the weekends to get your Cruiser fill :)

Heck, I'd even be willing to let you put on my new Kayline soft top :hill: that you could then drop down for some open top running! After you are done with that I've got plenty of other items that should keep you busy for a summer of wrenching :D

leiniesred
12-04-2006, 02:48 PM
Had a Jeep CJ5 (1980) it was cold, but very fun and cheap to fix. It was totally worn out in every way, but always ran. Swapped the engine for the same junkyard engine and it got 24MPG (once.) It had tons of personality.

For example: "Winter Jeep operation instructions."

Stick Budweiser cardboard between grill and radiator to prevent frostbite. Open door. Brush snow off seat. Try not to slip on iced, rusty floorboard. (no carpet or floor mats in this stripper) grab top corner of window and give it a good YANK to frature the ice on the outside of the glass. Start scraping frost from the inside of the glass. start truck. Allow to warm (the engine, not you) while you scrape the ice from the outside of the window.

Use both feet to kick the Dana 300 T-case "NASCAR style " into 4x4.
There. Off ya go. Turn on headlight. (one is good enough). 45 mph on the two lane, oncoming big rig. Hold onto the d---Too late. vacuum from big rig sucks the doors off the Jeep. Stop, backup to retrieve doors. Off ya go again!

My Toyota has been much more comfortable and reliable, but alas, the windshield will never fold down.

leiniesred
12-04-2006, 03:14 PM
Here is a picture of the Jeep being flat towed to Michigan behind my Mom's FJ62. The best was when the Jeep (with all of it's "personality") would decide to turn right while The Cruiser was towing it around a LEFT-HAND corner. The first time we stopped. After that, we just dragged the Jeep sideways until it got the idea we were turning the OTHER way. *shrugs*

farnhamstj
12-04-2006, 03:21 PM
Don't they revoke your TLCA membership if you buy a jeep? Jeeps are super easy to come by but will require lots of labor and $$$. FJ40's are also easy to come by and require lots of labor and $$$, but you have friends that will help you. What's the problem finding one? Pull the trigger.
Have you thought about a VW/dune buggy? Do a e-bay search for sandrails. I've always wanted a metalic purple speedbuggy myself. Beep Beep.
I've got no problems with Jeeps only the idiots driving them.

Rezarf
12-04-2006, 03:39 PM
I can't resist chiming in on a possible jeep purchase. I just have one thing to say...

Cruisers are flat out cooler.

I think there are a lot of options for finding a 40, but like it has been said before you have to just dive in head first, tune it up, then fix all the PO stuff, and you are up and running.

Get a 40 and DD the poo out of it... however, I got my wrenching fix satisfied a long time ago. :lmao:

This is the part of the thread where you tell us you were just joking. :thumb:

Drew

Rezarf
12-04-2006, 03:54 PM
Come on seriously is there a choice?
Both of these cost about the same... :D

timmbuck2
12-04-2006, 05:12 PM
hey, I agree there is no choice.....but if I can't find a 40.....

subzali
12-04-2006, 05:59 PM
Then you stay 40-less and Jeep-less. Come on, it's winter time, you only take the top off during the winter the first winter you own it (ask me how I know:rolleyes: mister drive with my ski-goggles on :rolleyes:), so you have a few months to find one in good shape before taking the top off even becomes an issue. more :twocents: :hill:

Kipper
12-04-2006, 06:27 PM
<edited>

MDH33
12-04-2006, 06:33 PM
hey, I agree there is no choice.....but if I can't find a 40.....

Speaking from recent experience, if you look hard enough you will find a great 40. There are A LOT of them here in Colorado that need a good home. You have to live, eat, breath, 40! Everyday I would look in the paper, on Craigslist, the other online auto traders, etc. Every day. They come up for sale often but they sell quick, so you have to be quicker than the rest. Two words: Cruiser Fund. Keep the cash handy for the quick purchase. Keep the word out that you're looking and cruiserheads will help you out when they see one.

Don't give up and settle for a lesser vehicle.

:thumb:

farnhamstj
12-04-2006, 07:46 PM
hey, I agree there is no choice.....but if I can't find a 40.....
There are at least 10 40's on e-bay at the moment and 7 in TT. Come on are you actually looking? Sure you won't find a rust free runner for under 3K but there are tons of 40's out there. How many does Mike have in his backyard? You can get rust free or runner for under 4K. You will get a similar condition vehical for similar cash jeep or Toyota. I guess I don't really care go ahead buy the jeep. How about posting up a photo of the one your thinking about.

timmbuck2
12-04-2006, 08:37 PM
I am checking newspapers, mud, here, craigslist, etc, several times per day. I would prefer to find something local I can check out myself rather than take a chance on an eBay beast. I don't have a heep in mind, just getting frustrated with the search.



There are at least 10 40's on e-bay at the moment and 7 in TT. Come on are you actually looking? Sure you won't find a rust free runner for under 3K but there are tons of 40's out there. How many does Mike have in his backyard? You can get rust free or runner for under 4K. You will get a similar condition vehical for similar cash jeep or Toyota. I guess I don't really care go ahead buy the jeep. How about posting up a photo of the one your thinking about.

MDH33
12-05-2006, 01:42 PM
Did you check this one out?

FJ40 on Craigslist cheap (http://denver.craigslist.org/car/243105273.html)

Hulk
12-05-2006, 06:22 PM
What's your budget / target condition? If you're looking for a $2k Cruiser, that's quite a bit different than a $10k Cruiser.

ginericLC
12-06-2006, 03:08 PM
Heck, I can think of another solution for you. Buy a Celica GT convertible. It will sit nice next to your 80 and balance the 80 out. You'd get speed, better mileage and your drop top. They are readily available. They are fairly inexpensive to buy and they are inexpensive on repairs. Then you would be never tempted to take it off road.

timmbuck2
12-07-2006, 08:28 AM
Heck, I can think of another solution for you. Buy a Celica GT convertible. It will sit nice next to your 80 and balance the 80 out. You'd get speed, better mileage and your drop top. They are readily available. They are fairly inexpensive to buy and they are inexpensive on repairs. Then you would be never tempted to take it off road.

heck, not a bad idea! I would probably buy another old mustang convertible if I went that route.

timmbuck2
12-30-2006, 02:16 PM
Any 40 experts want to give me some advice? I'll buy the beer next meeting. Email me at timmbuck2@yahoo.com so I can email you some pics. Thanks.

TB2

Beater
12-31-2006, 08:00 AM
I'm not a 40 expert, let alone an expert on anything. But food for thought...

I was, and still am a little, a died in the wool Rover guy. Pre-92 only, as they were "electronics free" ( no abs, all were coilers, no traction assist). Basically 3/4 ton trucks with creature comforts. Much more "soul" than my 80 could ever have. Just a flat out cool vehicle. That being said, I don't have to worry about that "coolness" ever getting in the way on a trip, around town, or even just trying to get out of my driveway in the 80.

My point? I love vehicles with personality. Hell, I have a tricked out vespa for crissakes. BUT, if I were to buy a 40, I wouldn't touch one that hadn't been gone through by someone else already, or hadn't been kept up well, and I would expect to pay upwards of 9~15k for one. To me, the up front pain of purchase would make the "coolness" that much more worth it.

As for cj/yj/tj's, the quality control just isn't there. It is after you have replaced everything, and that can be cool, but I have never seen one I would own that hadn't had axles/tranny/t-case/steering/top swapped out. The 6 cylinder motor is a beast, and quite good imho, but the manual tranny's leave a lot to be desired.

As for 40's, I have always been amazed by the durability and strength of stock 40's. I have been in many areas of the world, and I have seen a bunch of stock 40's and LR's, but NEVER did I see heeps in these places except m141's.

If I were looking for a fun convertable type wheeler, I would by a disco, rangie or 60/62 and cut the top off and rhino-line the interior, or a 84-85 four-runner with a soft top. The only jeep I would buy for this purpose would be a commando. They are cool, cheep, and fun, with no real mechanical shortcomings other than axles, and those are bolt ins from anything with 44's.

j

wesintl
01-02-2007, 09:01 PM
Any 40 experts want to give me some advice? I'll buy the beer next meeting. Email me at timmbuck2@yahoo.com so I can email you some pics. Thanks.

TB2

Did you purchase?

timmbuck2
01-02-2007, 09:12 PM
nope....never heard from anyone and he sold it...

Hulk
01-02-2007, 09:58 PM
nope....never heard from anyone and he sold it...

Why didn't you post up some pictures and details here? We would have given you all the advice in the world.

timmbuck2
01-03-2007, 09:18 AM
Why didn't you post up some pictures and details here? We would have given you all the advice in the world.

I was being selfish and didn't want anyone else to know about it. :o My fault...

MDH33
01-03-2007, 09:26 AM
Treeroot just posted this one for you in the Todays Craiglist thread:

http://denver.craigslist.org/car/256197850.html

Go take a look!!

Hulk
01-03-2007, 10:35 AM
I was being selfish and didn't want anyone else to know about it. :o My fault...

I know how that is, what with the recent crap of the 45 on Craigslist that ended up on eBay. You can always send a PM to a group of us with pics and details attached. None of the RS members would buy a Cruiser out from under you.

Feel free to send questions to me, anytime. There are plenty of other folks in the club who would be glad to help you evaluate a Cruiser as well.

timmbuck2
01-03-2007, 12:16 PM
I know how that is, what with the recent crap of the 45 on Craigslist that ended up on eBay. You can always send a PM to a group of us with pics and details attached. None of the RS members would buy a Cruiser out from under you.

Feel free to send questions to me, anytime. There are plenty of other folks in the club who would be glad to help you evaluate a Cruiser as well.

that 45 did end up on ebay?!?!

I trust you guys...it is the lurkers I am unsure about...

Thanks all!

T

FJBen
01-04-2007, 09:32 AM
I know how that is, what with the recent crap of the 45 on Craigslist that ended up on eBay.


Link??? not that I didn't know it was going to ebay...

Hulk
01-04-2007, 11:02 AM
I think he pulled it off.

timmbuck2
01-04-2007, 11:11 AM
very curious to see the 45 on ebay....

the 40 I was looking at was the $650 one on Craigslist with no motor or tranny. he sold it 2 days ago...guess where it is now...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1963-TOYOTA-FJ40-LAND-CRUISER-FJ-40-PARTS_W0QQitemZ290067723876QQihZ019QQcategoryZ6443QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

sigh...

Hulk
01-04-2007, 11:17 AM
the 40 I was looking at was the $650 one on Craigslist with no motor or tranny. he sold it 2 days ago...guess where it is now...
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1963-TOYOTA-FJ40-LAND-CRUISER-FJ-40-PARTS_W0QQitemZ290067723876QQihZ019QQcategoryZ6443QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem


That's a drag dude. For $650, that would have made a decent starter rig. If you're looking for something old and cool, to drive around town, a '63 certainly would have been pretty neat.

However, if you're building a rock crawler, you'd be better off starting with a 1976 or newer rig -- fewer things to replace, fewer weak points.

timmbuck2
01-04-2007, 11:19 AM
That's a drag dude. For $650, that would have made a decent starter rig. If you're looking for something old and cool, to drive around town, a '63 certainly would have been pretty neat.

However, if you're building a rock crawler, you'd be better off starting with a 1976 or newer rig -- fewer things to replace, fewer weak points.

the guy emailed me and told me the first guy flaked out on him, did I want the truck? I said yes, when can I come see it? The next day he puts it back on Craigslist, then emails me that it is sold. GRRR....

would the no-title thing have been hard to deal with?

T

Hulk
01-04-2007, 01:24 PM
The no-title thing is something other members have dealt with. I think if it was last registered in Colorado, that makes it pretty easy. If it is out-of-state, it's a bit harder.

wesintl
01-04-2007, 01:32 PM
Don't worry. I don't think it'll go anywhere for $1600. It's not worth 1k IMHO... $650 I could see.

timmbuck2
01-04-2007, 02:13 PM
Don't worry. I don't think it'll go anywhere for $1600. It's not worth 1k IMHO... $650 I could see.

I should bid $500. :)

Hulk
01-04-2007, 02:16 PM
You definitely should. Or even $650. :D

timmbuck2
01-04-2007, 02:53 PM
Don't worry. I don't think it'll go anywhere for $1600. It's not worth 1k IMHO... $650 I could see.

sold for $1600 via Buy It Now. Tidy $1000 profit for a flipper.

:(

wesintl
01-04-2007, 04:25 PM
as usual I was wrong :(

timmbuck2
01-05-2007, 09:49 AM
Link??? not that I didn't know it was going to ebay...

here is a quote from the guy who sold the 45...

guy came up i followed him to his barn where he has about 12 land
cruisers all very nice shape nice young man

can we confirm it was on ebay? could this be Razor?

who has a barn full of 12 land cruisers?!?! I am almost as annoyed by the "hoarders" as I am the flippers. :) I would love to be wrenching on just 1 of those 12 cruisers!

:rolleyes:

T

SteveH
01-05-2007, 02:48 PM
The first Wrangler I really saw was owned by a hunting buddy. It was an '88 model. Rode well, compared to an FJ40 with sagged out suspension, but it had no articulation and the carb didn't work well (only failed while elk hunting in the middle of nowhere).

What really struck me is that we jacked it up to install tire chains and the wing nut holding the jack down under the hood was *plastic*. It had never been removed, but stripped out as we removed it to get to the jack. A plastic wing nut to retain the jack? 'Nuff said. I wish I could have loved this Wrangler more, but as a 4x newbie, I was repulsed. Thankfully.

Steve

FJBen
01-05-2007, 04:12 PM
here is a quote from the guy who sold the 45...

guy came up i followed him to his barn where he has about 12 land
cruisers all very nice shape nice young man

can we confirm it was on ebay? could this be Razor?

who has a barn full of 12 land cruisers?!?! I am almost as annoyed by the "hoarders" as I am the flippers. :) I would love to be wrenching on just 1 of those 12 cruisers!

:rolleyes:

T

interesting....very interesting...would love to see the link and seller...

timmbuck2
01-06-2007, 09:13 PM
AUUUUUUUUUUUUUGH! I am just not meant to have an FJ40....sigh...

so the guy who sold the 45 on craigslist emailed me and asked if I was interested in his 76 fj40 for $1400. I said yes, when can I come pick it up. He did not reply for a day, then put it on Craigslist for $1600. How much you want to bet the "guy with 12 land cruisers in the barn" buys it and it is on eBay tomorrow. ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://denver.craigslist.org/car/258766084.html
__________________

timmbuck2
01-07-2007, 08:22 PM
AUUUUUUUUUUUUUGH! I am just not meant to have an FJ40....sigh...

so the guy who sold the 45 on craigslist emailed me and asked if I was interested in his 76 fj40 for $1400. I said yes, when can I come pick it up. He did not reply for a day, then put it on Craigslist for $1600. How much you want to bet the "guy with 12 land cruisers in the barn" buys it and it is on eBay tomorrow. ARGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

http://denver.craigslist.org/car/258766084.html
__________________

now he emails me and says he is 78 and wants to kick my ass. sigh. Not sure why. I offered him more than he asked, and said I could pick it up at the end od the month. He is selling it for $5k to the "nice young fella" who bought his 45. Watch for it on eBay soon.

I offically give up on a 40 or a heep or whatever. Not worth the drama. I will put my cash into mods on my 80. Sigh.....

:rant:

By the way, hope to make a meeting soon, my hockey league is changing nights so Wednesday will be free more often. See you there. I will be the one WITHOUT a 40.