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timmbuck2
03-19-2007, 04:49 PM
Howdy all. As most of you know, with Mike and Ige's help I was able to wrestle Oleg's 73 FJ40 out of the mud and into my garage. http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=3268
As you can see in my sig, she has no engine, but I did get rid of the mouse poop over the weekend. :) After asking around and talking to a few people here and on Mud, I decided to get her on the road (or off-road) as soon as possible and worry about doing a complete restoration until later. Take a look at pics of the truck and the load of parts I got from Oleg: http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/index.html

Right now I think I am missing the following to get her up and running.
-engine/tranny/tcase: think I am getting a 2f/4spd/split t-case from Mike
-gas tank plus associated parts
-leaf springs (at least the front!) http://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=142726&highlight=%22wtf+day%22
-battery
-brake booster (I think everything else is there...) will probably need to tune the drums...anything else?
-no idea on radiator, looks ok, how can I test?
-steering looks ok
-windshield will need replaced eventually, will they look at that before I get it licensed?
-seats both frames look ok, ps needs recovering, ds needs new foam and recovering
-headlights
-backseat and rollbar if I want my son to ride and if I want to go topless
-driveshafts: prob find one in Mike's back yard. :)
-tires: might have a deal to grab some temp. tires and wheels. would like to put my 33" MTR's from my 80 on there, so I guess I would need 16inch rims.

Anything else obvious I am missing? My initial idea to start was to ask where I should begin, but looking at this list, I have plenty to do...the $700 for new leafs from Skyjacker and buying the engine will be the top priority, but realistically at least a few weeks away, so I guess I can start on the small things. All feedback is greatly appreciated, and if you have any parts, let me know!! Thanks for all the help and info everyone!

Timm

timmbuck2
03-19-2007, 04:50 PM
Thought I would mention my long-term goals for this truck. For now it will be an occasional daily driver, especially with the top down on nice sunny days, and a mild off-roader. The locked 80 gets me everywhere I need to go now offroad, and safer with the boy. The 40 will be for when I am up in the mountains by myself.

oh, and I already have a case of PB blaster! :)

T

treerootCO
03-19-2007, 05:38 PM
you have a good solid foundation to work from. I have the engine/trans/transfer and probably the driveshafts for you. I have an extra 73 style hard top if you wanted to replace the side that is damaged. I might have the handle and some other random stuff for you as well. I do have a set of seats that are in my way if you wanted to swap out the ones you have. I may even be able to get you 4 tires that hold air.

nuclearlemon
03-19-2007, 07:39 PM
dang...totally spaced when you were here...i've got that gas tank you can have. like i said, you may want ot get it boiled and coated, or get the coating and do it yourself.

i got some crappy old headlights that i took out of my 40 that you can have if you don't have the $ to front for lights for now. that way you can use your cashola for the other items.

dont' worry about your windshield for now...they won't reject your registration for it, if that's what you're worried about.

subzali
03-19-2007, 11:19 PM
I've got four tires and rims that I want to get rid of...they are very low on tread but still hold air, and one of them has a pretty bad bent rim...but I did Slaughterhouse, Castle Gulch and Crystal Mtn. with them plus a lot of other driving plus the PO driving before I got it. If you want them they're yours, I just want them gone. They'll work to at least get the thing rolling around. 32x11.50 on 15x8 black spoke rims (barely over 31" tall).

-Check that all brake cylinders are not frozen - if so, loosen or replace accordingly (I got mine to all work loose).
-Invest in some stainless steel braided brake hoses if yours are old and crusty.

Peace of cake, and good luck! :thumb: Sounds like a fun project, if it were me I would do like what it sounds you're going to do and get it running and tweak it here and there later. Yay a new Cruiser! :D

nakman
03-19-2007, 11:32 PM
I too have some headlights you can have. They were functioning on my 40 until about 2 weeks ago.

Why buy new skyjackers? There are stock leafs growing wild in Mike's backyard.. and other places as well. seems that $700 would be better spent elsewhere, today. just a thought. :)

timmbuck2
03-20-2007, 09:59 AM
Thanks for all the advice and help and offers everyone, I really appreciate it! I guess for now I will work on making sure the brakes and electrical are all there and working while I decide what to do about the leafs and wait on the engine. Any idea where I can find a brake booster? Are they very year-specific? (ie if I find a '74 or '72 on Mud would it work ok?) I also need to go order the manuals. Exciting to finally get my hands dirty! Thanks again everyone, I hope I can contribute half as much as you all are helping me.

T

Shark Bait
03-20-2007, 10:00 AM
Right now I think I am missing the following to get her up and running.
-engine/tranny/tcase: think I am getting a 2f/4spd/split t-case from Mike


Fun stuff!

You know you won't have an e-brake with a split case unless you put a "kit" on it. Might be MAF or SOR that sells it, I can't remember. I've got a 4-speed case and if you find a 3-speed transfer case you could put the guts into the 4-speed case. Then you'd be able to install the e-brake backing plate and drum. PM me if you're interested.

You might try to find a '76 or later axle for the front, or the right parts, and convert to disc brakes. I've got a few booster/master combinations and would be happy to give you one. Others may argue you don't need to do this, but when you get to the point of replacing and/or rebuilding wheel cylinders you might as well. I've also got some old e-brake cables, a backing plate with shoes attached and speedo cables and other junk lying around, when you're ready.

wesintl
03-20-2007, 10:11 AM
I would start with the engine and work out. There are quite a few little things that you could buy now but be affected by what you drop in and once you know your way around a 40 a little more you may want to do something different.

I wouldn't do anything but cleaning and paint the axles etc. until you get the engine tranny/xfer in. Plus alot of little things you buy add up and push out the engine buy and install.

-I would clean and paint what undercarriage that you can get to easily.
-Put the engine tranny and xfer in.
-get DS installed
-work on the brakes at that time, which may also allow disk brake upgrade depending on how much you need to put into the drums to get them working. Pull and save usually has a mini you can pull the knucles out for cheap. A 70-75 booster will work on drums. After that they are for disk brakes but they are somewhat interchangeable depending on what master you use and readily availabe from other model toyotas.
- Then I would tend to installing glass etc. and buying what items that weren't given to you like headlights, getting good tires etc.

Thats just MHO and :twocents: :twocents:

timmbuck2
03-20-2007, 10:34 AM
I would start with the engine and work out. There are quite a few little things that you could buy now but be affected by what you drop in and once you know your way around a 40 a little more you may want to do something different.

I wouldn't do anything but cleaning and paint the axles etc. until you get the engine tranny/xfer in. Plus alot of little things you buy add up and push out the engine buy and install.

-I would clean and paint what undercarriage that you can get to easily.
-Put the engine tranny and xfer in.
-get DS installed
-work on the brakes at that time, which may also allow disk brake upgrade depending on how much you need to put into the drums to get them working. Pull and save usually has a mini you can pull the knucles out for cheap. A 70-75 booster will work on drums. After that they are for disk brakes but they are somewhat interchangeable depending on what master you use and readily availabe from other model toyotas.
- Then I would tend to installing glass etc. and buying what items that weren't given to you like headlights, getting good tires etc.

Thats just MHO and :twocents: :twocents:

What works best for cleaning and painting the undercarriage and axles, etc?

Get DS installed?

:)

T

timmbuck2
03-20-2007, 11:36 AM
from looking at a 71 FSM, it looks like I have the reservoir tanks for the booster, but no booster or master cylinder....or is it a tandem MC? Anyone who looked at my pictures agree or disagree? :) I have SOOO much to learn...


T

wesintl
03-20-2007, 11:54 AM
from looking at a 71 FSM, it looks like I have the reservoir tanks for the booster, but no booster or master cylinder....or is it a tandem MC? Anyone who looked at my pictures agree or disagree? :) I have SOOO much to learn...


T

above the steering column you have a blank spot and 4 holes to which a booster mounts, the master then mounts to the booster. See SOR diagram...
http://www.sor.com/sor/cat014.tam?xax=7542&page%2Ectx=cat014%2Etam

You could clean up the frame with a wire wheel and paint it with POR, Zero rust, or rust oleum. Stuff like that.

Hulk
03-20-2007, 06:13 PM
You know you won't have an e-brake with a split case unless you put a "kit" on it.

Here's the kit (http://www.sor.com/sor/cat076.tam?xax=30369&anchor=#076-15D-KIT). $499 from Specter. Looks like it is Toyota stuff.

http://www.sor.com/shared/image/076-15D-KIT-big.jpg

timmbuck2
03-20-2007, 10:11 PM
Here's the kit (http://www.sor.com/sor/cat076.tam?xax=30369&anchor=#076-15D-KIT). $499 from Specter. Looks like it is Toyota stuff.

http://www.sor.com/shared/image/076-15D-KIT-big.jpg

$499? Can't I just use a 2x4???? :eek:

T

Shark Bait
03-20-2007, 11:58 PM
Tim,

Did you get my reply to your PM? Lots of stuff, I know. Dig deep in that pocket. :D

Now that I see your pics again, I notice you do have the parking brake backing plate & drum on your 3-speed t-case. Get that conversion t-case input gear and the 4-speed tranny and you'll be in business. Depending on what you get engine wise, you can run the clutch fork on either side. You're set up for DS now, but you could get the "later" model hard line and run it on the PS pretty easily.

subzali
03-21-2007, 12:01 AM
LOL not if you want to pass CM inspection...:D

I think Hatfield's idea was pretty good about the t-case, and Wes is right about getting the engine/tranny/transfer first because those are huge and probably will cost the most. If you can't move the truck forward you don't really need brakes anyway :rolleyes:

I don't understand the "install the DS" comment either? :confused: Driveshafts? Yeah you kinda need those to move forward too, and then you can worry about the brakes so you can stop it from moving...yeah :D

timmbuck2
03-21-2007, 10:21 AM
LOL not if you want to pass CM inspection...:D

I think Hatfield's idea was pretty good about the t-case, and Wes is right about getting the engine/tranny/transfer first because those are huge and probably will cost the most. If you can't move the truck forward you don't really need brakes anyway :rolleyes:

I don't understand the "install the DS" comment either? :confused: Driveshafts? Yeah you kinda need those to move forward too, and then you can worry about the brakes so you can stop it from moving...yeah :D

Thanks guys...yeah, the engine/tran/TC is in the works, but probably will not be available for several weeks, so there is plenty of time to mess around with other stuff...like learning where everything goes on a 40!

T

Hulk
03-21-2007, 11:34 AM
If you have the 3-speed case and plan to use it, you won't need the "kit" I posted. It's only if you're planning to use the later split case, like I have on my 81 FJ40. On mine, the parking brake is the two rear drums.

Actually, I think we have approved parking brake systems that involved wheel chocks. A 2x4 is weak though. You'd be better off getting a 4x4 chunk of wood and cutting it to make 4 wedges. The main purpose of the parking brake is to make sure your rig doesn't roll backwards off a cliff when your dog jumps into your rig and knocks the tranny out of gear. :O

wesintl
03-21-2007, 11:41 AM
I don't understand the "install the DS" comment either? :confused: Driveshafts?

yes, Driveshafts. Depending on if you use the stock 3 speed and 3speed xfer, later 4 speed or 4 speed and split case etc. There are a bunch of combinations you can go forth with. This affects Driveshaft length and mixing and matching flanges. Alot of $$ can be dumped into buying flanges and driveshafts, lengthening, etc. Again another reason to get the engine/tranny/xfer before you start on the little things.

timmbuck2
03-21-2007, 11:51 AM
The parking brake issue will easily cause me to go slowly insane...mainly because there are 100 different opinions on Mud and I still am not 100% sure on the naming conventions of everything and unfamiliar with everything to start with. I am getting a 4 speed tranny with the split case, and I have a 3 speed tranny already with a tc. I am sure it will make more sense once I get my hands dirty. And as you can see in my pics, I do have bright orange wheel chocks! I did not think that something as simple as a parking brake could run me almost more than I paid for the truck! :) Thanks again...

T

wesintl
03-21-2007, 11:58 AM
I am getting a 4 speed tranny with the split case, and I have a 3 speed tranny already with a tc.

The split cases from '80 (can't remember the exact year) on put the parking brake on the rear axel at the wheels. Before that the parking brake on cruisers was attached to the back of the xfer case at the driveshaft. So, now you don't have a parking brake. Personally I think if you going with a split case either buy the SOR or man-a-fre kit or find a rear axle from a late 40 to fix it, JMHO. I've never looked into if you can take the outer bake items off the rear of a 60 and add the parking brake at the axle to a 40. Or just forget about it and run a line lock on your brake system.

corsair23
03-21-2007, 12:17 PM
I did not think that something as simple as a parking brake could run me almost more than I paid for the truck! :) Thanks again...

T


Always fun to see the wide eyes when the cost of a project FJ40 starts sinking in :hill:. I think this is one reason why so many encourage folks to just get the 40 on the road and drive it before going too crazy. That makes sure the "hook" is DEEPLY set before the addiction can wear off :lmao:

On my '76 I probably had $13K invested into it (not including all the parts I've been selling off) and it wasn't really anywhere near to being complete in my eyes. Take it slow, let that hook sink in deeply, and enjoy the ride! :thumb:

MDH33
03-22-2007, 01:08 PM
Not to hijack Timmbuck2's thread, but I think this relates to his build:

When adding a booster and 2 reservoir master cylinder to a '73 FJ40, different brake hard lines will be needed. (I'm doing brakes on my '73 also).

Is there anywhere locally that will custom bend hard lines with the the proper fittings? Thanks.

Good luck with your build Tim. You're welcome to look over my 40 anytime. I have a stock 3 speed and TC mated to a later 2F.

timmbuck2
03-22-2007, 04:09 PM
Not to hijack Timmbuck2's thread, but I think this relates to his build:

When adding a booster and 2 reservoir master cylinder to a '73 FJ40, different brake hard lines will be needed. (I'm doing brakes on my '73 also).

Is there anywhere locally that will custom bend hard lines with the the proper fittings? Thanks.

Good luck with your build Tim. You're welcome to look over my 40 anytime. I have a stock 3 speed and TC mated to a later 2F.

Mine seems to already have a booster and 2 reservoir MC...could it have been added later??

T

MDH33
03-22-2007, 04:22 PM
Mine seems to already have a booster and 2 reservoir MC...could it have been added later??

T

I'm thinking that was not stock on a '73, but maybe someone with more accumulated year-specific 40 trivia can answer.

Are your hard lines already connected from the MC to frame? I would be curious to know if they are a stock part that I can order rather than custom bending lines, which is what I am facing right now...

timmbuck2
03-22-2007, 04:47 PM
I'm thinking that was not stock on a '73, but maybe someone with more accumulated year-specific 40 trivia can answer.

Are your hard lines already connected from the MC to frame? I would be curious to know if they are a stock part that I can order rather than custom bending lines, which is what I am facing right now...

Well, actually I am missing a booster (but it looks like 1 was there) and the MC is sitting on a shelf. :) I will see if the hard lines are still there...

T

timmbuck2
03-22-2007, 04:53 PM
Well, actually I am missing a booster (but it looks like 1 was there) and the MC is sitting on a shelf. :) I will see if the hard lines are still there...

T

The hardlines look stock to me...but I am a f'n newbie. :cool:

http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target50.html

T

wesintl
03-22-2007, 04:57 PM
That's stock. 7/70- 3/73 and 3/73- 1/75 have a booster and 2 cup master that dumps out between the cups. As far as I can tell they are identical 47210.

timmbuck2
03-22-2007, 05:03 PM
That's stock. 7/70- 3/73 and 3/73- 1/75 have a booster and 2 cup master that dumps out between the cups. As far as I can tell they are identical 47210.

Cool...and where can I go to decode my VIN to find out more info on build dates? :)

T

wesintl
03-22-2007, 05:07 PM
what's this say? OCT 1973? It's kinda fuzzy ;)

http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target58.html

Shark Bait
03-22-2007, 05:10 PM
I saw that you had two brake lines. Like I said, I've got a few boosters. You can have one. Come on by.

timmbuck2
03-22-2007, 05:13 PM
what's this say? OCT 1973? It's kinda fuzzy ;)

http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target58.html

Told ya I was a f'n newbie! :hill: :homer:

T

wesintl
03-22-2007, 05:21 PM
Told ya I was a f'n newbie! :hill: :homer:

T

seriously tho.. I can't make out the month.... ?:confused:

timmbuck2
03-22-2007, 05:22 PM
So, the plan for this weekend is to just clean things up a little and take more inventory of what I have and what I am missing. I guess I will wire-wheel all I can easily get to on the axle, undercarriage, etc and POR-15 all I can reach. Any suggestions for the engine bay? Clean and paint?? Might as well get to what I can while the engine is out.

T

timmbuck2
03-22-2007, 05:27 PM
seriously tho.. I can't make out the month.... ?:confused:

I'll take a better pic this weekend.

T

corsair23
03-23-2007, 01:37 AM
Any suggestions for the engine bay? Clean and paint?? Might as well get to what I can while the engine is out.

Are you going to leave the 40 totally stock, unmolested? Or build it up a little and possibly repaint it down the road?

If it is the latter, then my suggestion would be to paint the bay black. It would go with whatever paint choice you chose down the road. And, IMO if you ever do decide to sell and the new owner doesn't like the color you chose, they can repaint without having to fart around with the engine bay or having a two tone rig :thumb:. This is one of the few things that bugs me about my 40...

nuclearlemon
03-23-2007, 08:12 AM
what's this say? OCT 1973? It's kinda fuzzy ;)

http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target58.html

apr 73 :)

74fj40
03-23-2007, 08:58 AM
We thought about replacing the 40 rear axle brake stuff with the stuff from a 60 axle so we could use the rear ebrake system with the 40 axle, but found the mounting hardware was different. We ended up just replacing the rear axle with the 60 axle and modifying the cable to use the existing under the dash brake lever.
The split cases from '80 (can't remember the exact year) on put the parking brake on the rear axel at the wheels. Before that the parking brake on cruisers was attached to the back of the xfer case at the driveshaft. So, now you don't have a parking brake. Personally I think if you going with a split case either buy the SOR or man-a-fre kit or find a rear axle from a late 40 to fix it, JMHO. I've never looked into if you can take the outer bake items off the rear of a 60 and add the parking brake at the axle to a 40. Or just forget about it and run a line lock on your brake system.

timmbuck2
03-23-2007, 09:53 AM
apr 73 :)

Thanks Ige...my camera sucks at focusing on very close objects....or I suck...take your pick. :rolleyes:

T

timmbuck2
03-23-2007, 09:58 AM
Are you going to leave the 40 totally stock, unmolested? Or build it up a little and possibly repaint it down the road?

If it is the latter, then my suggestion would be to paint the bay black. It would go with whatever paint choice you chose down the road. And, IMO if you ever do decide to sell and the new owner doesn't like the color you chose, they can repaint without having to fart around with the engine bay or having a two tone rig :thumb:. This is one of the few things that bugs me about my 40...

The plan for now is minor building up...definitely want to take it off-road, but no major rock crawling. A new paint job will definitely be on the list a few years from now. My wife does not think the baby blue color is manly enough for me. :D Would any high-temp rattle can stuff work for the engine bay and assorted parts?? Would a black bay look good with a lighter colored truck?

T

Shark Bait
03-23-2007, 10:37 AM
Tim,

From looking at your pictures, and my own personal bias (read laziness), I wouldn't re-paint the entire engine bay. I'd remove that thing that looks like a dual battery tray and scrape/brush and paint over the rusty and exposed metal places. That's all. You can get carried away with touch up. :)

Chris

74fj40
03-23-2007, 11:16 AM
If you do decide to repaint the entire engine bay (its extra work for sure, but much easier now while the engine's out) - we primed and then top coated with spray cans of undercoating from checker/ace. Looks great and so far pretty durable.

timmbuck2
03-23-2007, 12:01 PM
If you do decide to repaint the entire engine bay (its extra work for sure, but much easier now while the engine's out) - we primed and then top coated with spray cans of undercoating from checker/ace. Looks great and so far pretty durable.

Cool, thanks for the info. Any pics? :) Was the primer high-temp? How rough texture was the undercoating?

T

MDH33
03-23-2007, 12:13 PM
Cool, thanks for the info. Any pics? :) Was the primer high-temp? How rough texture was the undercoating?

T

I would vote for just cleaning it up and keeping it original for now. If you decide to do a full blown resto on the body in the future, you'll be dismantling it anyway. For now I would just clean it up and enjoy it with it's original patina. :thumb: :hill:

wesintl
03-23-2007, 12:18 PM
I would vote for just cleaning it up and keeping it original for now. If you decide to do a full blown resto on the body in the future, you'll be dismantling it anyway. For now I would just clean it up and enjoy it with it's original patina. :thumb: :hill:

I agree, That cruiser looks pretty clean from the photos esp what still has blue paint on it. It's the rusty stuff i'd clean up and put black paint on. That should keep you busy for a while... :cheers:

btw nice reverse lamp
http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target63.html

if you want to get rid of this switch on the right below the blank let me know ;)
http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target61.html

MDH33
03-23-2007, 01:23 PM
btw nice reverse lamp
http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target63.html

Yeah that '73 reverse lamp is a hard to replace part. Very cool. :cool:

if you want to get rid of this switch on the right below the blank let me know ;)
http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target61.html

What is that switch for?? I have one too but it doesn't seem to be connected to anything. :confused:

Shark Bait
03-23-2007, 02:50 PM
Panic button?

It opens and closes the convertible top?

Might be a hazard switch. I have some old switches like that that are red.

Shark Bait
03-23-2007, 02:58 PM
From SOR's website. 1968-1972 dash. It's a switch for an interior light when you have a canvas top.

wesintl
03-23-2007, 03:29 PM
It's definatly a "room lamp" switch...

timmbuck2
04-01-2007, 11:53 PM
ok, been searching here and on Mud for hours, thought I would post before it drives me nutty. Put the original (I think) dual MC on the 40 today with a booster I grabbed from Shark Bait (THANKS!) Got everything hooked up and filled with fluid. Both pressure switches are leaking fluid, the rear one drained in 30 minutes. I am guessing they are not supposed to leak out the pressure switches. Worth trying to rebuild? I see on SOR I can replaced just the switches, but if the seals are bad there, I would guess they are all bad. After I pumped the brakes a few times there was also fluid sprayed in the engine bay, so I think they are leaking good. Or I am doing something very newbie wrong? :) Thanks.

T

PS-I have pics, will post tomorrow.

Rezarf
04-02-2007, 01:22 AM
Tim-

I painted my inner fenders and engine bay with the engine out, I didn't use the high temp paint, it seemed a little over kill. I used the Rustoleum hard hat industrial stuff and I got great results, just follow the instructions for recoat times and prep.

Mark a line on the fenders before removing them to know where to run a tape/masking line to keep your color on the outside looking good. Oh, and mask off the vents in the sides of the cowls area (above the kick vents) I didn't and over spray went through them.

I think it does wonders for "cleaning up" an old truck.

Just my .02

timmbuck2
04-02-2007, 09:44 AM
Tim-

I painted my inner fenders and engine bay with the engine out, I didn't use the high temp paint, it seemed a little over kill. I used the Rustoleum hard hat industrial stuff and I got great results, just follow the instructions for recoat times and prep.

Mark a line on the fenders before removing them to know where to run a tape/masking line to keep your color on the outside looking good. Oh, and mask off the vents in the sides of the cowls area (above the kick vents) I didn't and over spray went through them.

I think it does wonders for "cleaning up" an old truck.

Just my .02

Cool...what color did you use? Any pics? :) You remember how many coats you used? I put 2 primer coats and 2 black coats on my brake booster, and it still got all scratched up when I mounted it on the truck.

Thanks!

T

timmbuck2
04-02-2007, 11:33 AM
I too have some headlights you can have. They were functioning on my 40 until about 2 weeks ago.

Why buy new skyjackers? There are stock leafs growing wild in Mike's backyard.. and other places as well. seems that $700 would be better spent elsewhere, today. just a thought. :)

Cool, the headlights would be much appreciated.

I think I am goint to grab some stock 40 leafs from Ben's old 40. Should be an easy swap? Anything I need to worry about??

Thanks all!

T
:cheers:

timmbuck2
04-06-2007, 09:19 AM
UPDATES:

I have brakes. :) Found the right bolt in the coffee can, filled with fluid, and bled the system. The nasty dark rusty fluid is out and the brakes work well enough to stop the 40 from rolling out of the garage! :) So I moved on to the beautiful leaf springs. Ige is trying to tell me this is not stock, is she crazy? :D Got the damaged leaf off last night with some help from a BFH. Picking up the used leafs this weekend, will probably go ahead and swap out all 4 while I am at it. Had my first 40 related injury...went to go under the 40 to bleed the brakes and forgot the broken leaf was hanging so low...right on my forehead. Nice golf-ball sized knot. Luckily, I have a very hard head. Wife was surprised when she pulled in the garage at 10pm, and I come out from under the truck with a huge knot and blood on my forehead. I am a hockey player, so I guess she is used to it. Thanks again for all the support and advice! Hope to see a lot of you this weekend at the raffle rig.

T

ps-pics later...

farnhamstj
04-06-2007, 07:31 PM
Glad you're making progress. That spring looks stock to me, just not the shape of it. I found 3M wheels that look like a big black scotch brite to work much better than wire wheels, but you can eat them fast on sharp edges. Are you driving that to CM07? If so, you may have hit your head a little harder than you thought.

timmbuck2
08-27-2007, 10:46 AM
OK, if I am going to make it to eh 40's Only Run in September, I need to get to work on this engine...so how does everyone's schedule look like the next couple of weeks. I know...very busy time for everyone, but would be awesome to maybe find a weeknight or 2 if weekends are scarce to at least get the engine in the truck so I can start work on getting it running and get the driveshafts measured, exhaust work, electrical, etc etc. Thanks to Subzali for volunteering to help, he mentioned motor mounts...it originally had an F and I am putting in a 2F...I will post a pic later of what is in the truck now, but here is a link to a pic...

Anything else I should make sure I have in place before dropping the sucker? Fluids, etc?

I do need to go get the tank that Ige :bowdown: (THANKS!!!!) gave me relined...

Thanks to all for helping this newbie out. I am contributing as much as I can to the club as a whole, and can't wait to share everything I learn with the newbies that will be here....

Timm


OOPS....posted in 2 places...please use this thread....thanks.

:bowdown:

MDH33
08-27-2007, 10:56 AM
I'm no expert, but I can lend a hand.

Have you done any research about your throttle linkages? That might be something else that will need to be modified when switching from the F to 2F. Motor mounts will be the same. Toyota sells the FJ60 2F style (square) as replacement for the crumby round ones. CDan can hook you up with those.

Questions:

Is this a 2F from a 40 or 60??

What carb is on the engine?

Smog stuff?

What trans/TC are you going to run?

Does it have manual or power steering?

timmbuck2
08-27-2007, 11:00 AM
I will call Cdan right now, thanks for the tip.

2f from a 60. Treeroot can fill in the details. No idea on carb or smog stuff. Has the 4speed and split t-case already attached to the engine. Hmmm...will I need to cut a new hole in the floor? Manual steering....


Thanks!!!

Timm



I'm no expert, but I can lend a hand.

Have you done any research about your throttle linkages? That might be something else that will need to be modified when switching from the F to 2F. Motor mounts will be the same. Toyota sells the FJ60 2F style (square) as replacement for the crumby round ones. CDan can hook you up with those.

Questions:

Is this a 2F from a 40 or 60??

What carb is on the engine?

Smog stuff?

What trans/TC are you going to run?

Does it have manual or power steering?

Romer
08-27-2007, 11:08 AM
No need for Smog stuff on a 73, wasn't required. All the smog stuff was removed on my 2F in Tim's new 77 FJ40 and it passed fine twice (Once for each owner)

Go with a 2 barrel Asian crab. If you can get it rebuilt by Jim Chenworth (FJ40Jim on Mud) you couldn't do better. he is the guru of Asian carbs.
Don't think you will have to cut a hole in the floor, but Ige could tell you.


If I can help will depend on when.

treerootCO
08-27-2007, 02:02 PM
I'll have to find a thread on mud I read once. The motor will bolt in with the later style motor mounts on the engine side. The bell housing mounts will need to be sourced from the earlier style. If I remember correctly, you can add the old mounts to the new bell housing but might need to tap and drill a hole. The other option is to adapt the newer crossmember that is used in the splitcase to the older truck.

Some people don't but if you run an older truck through colorado air care inc. they will do a visual for smog even if it meets the 25 yr plus rules.

SteveH
08-27-2007, 02:16 PM
You will need a early style bellhousing to easily bolt an FJ60 tranny into an early FJ40 frame. I suppose you could drill/tap the FJ60 bellhousing (as Treeroot suggested), but that may not be worth the trouble. You may also need to move the clutch fork to the other side of the tranny depending on where your clutch line is on the truck. Just pay attention to this as it all comes together.

Also, you will likely find that the tunnel cover rests on the top of the 4 speed tranny and you will either need a body lift or to modify the tunnel cover (more than a little) to clear the tranny. If you let the tunnel cover just sit on the tranny, you'll hear evil sounds in your truck, amplified by the tunnel cover. Mine was unbearably loud. With an FJ60 trans/xfer you won't have a parking brake, either - just an FYI.

timmbuck2
08-27-2007, 02:23 PM
ok, is it really worth the 2f and 4 speed then?? Why shouldn't I just get a decent F and drop it in there? I have the 3speed and Tcase (I think...) I thought this was going to be a bolt-in job, and I don't have the skills yet for a 4-banana job...

T

MDH33
08-27-2007, 02:26 PM
Does your rig still have the stock 3 speed and TC in it? If so, it might be easier to leave them in and just use the 2F with the 3 speed. I'm running this set-up in my 73 with a '69 Aisan 2 barrel and all smog stuff removed. Works great.

Edit: just missed your post above. Bolt the 2F to the 3 speed and you'll be ready to go. :)

timmbuck2
08-27-2007, 02:28 PM
I have the 3 speed in my garage...not sure about the t-case. Nothing is on the truck...sounds easier to just find an F. Then Treeroot can sell the 2f to someone else. :)

T

Shark Bait
08-27-2007, 02:32 PM
It's a little work, but in the end it'll be worth it. I'd get me the conversion gear kit for the 3-speed t-case (http://www.man-a-fre.com/parts_accessories/4speedtransmission3speedtransfercaseadapterkit.htm) and mount it up to the 4-speed tranny. Moving the clutch fork is easy. Then you have an e-brake, which you'll need for Cruise Moab. :D Find drive shafts from a 4-speed and they will be the right length. It's all very doable.

If you want, Tim, you can use the 3-speed bell housing on the 2F. No problem. Then maybe find a floor shifter for the 3-speed. But I'll bet someone has a FJ40 4-speed bell housing you could use. You'll be happier with the 4-speed tranny.

treerootCO
08-27-2007, 04:17 PM
The 2F has the same bolt pattern on the back of the engine. It will bolt directly to a 3speed bell housing, a 4 speed bell housing, or the FJ60 style 4 speed bell housing. The clutch flips from left to right throughout all the years so all the bell housings are made with the hook up to either side. I run a 3 speed bell housing behind my 2F with a 4 speed flywheel, an SM465 transmission, and a 3 speed style transfer case. My t-case is an Orion modified with all the 4 speed t-case shifter linkage. It all bolts up like legos, lincoln logs, erector set type ease.
http://www.root45.com/SM465Orion/

Just in case you were going to ask, I would not run an SM465 if I had the choice to do it again. A stock H42 4speed is one of the greatest transmissions ever made. http://www.root45.com/SM465Orion/Gears.htm

Romer
08-27-2007, 06:57 PM
You will be glad you have the 4 speed. really glad

I took the 40 to a mom and pop shop for emissions not Colorado air care. Was told it was easier to get it through.

Also, get the 5 year collector plate and you will never have to get emissions done as long as you own your vehicle.

timmbuck2
08-28-2007, 10:26 AM
Well, honestly, right now I am leaning toward selling the 40 and all the parts I have, and giving the 2f back to Treeroot. Then I could put the cash towards an already completed 40 (Nakman?) and not have to bother anyone to get my truck running. The 80 will be my main trail truck anyway...

T

timmbuck2
08-28-2007, 10:15 PM
http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?p=44947#post44947

corsair23
08-29-2007, 01:44 PM
:(

I can certainly understand given that I sold my '76 because I didn't have the time to dedicate to it and it was running and all, just needed some attention to the body.

Just don't get any ideas about trying to bring that TV back :hill:

timmbuck2
08-29-2007, 03:44 PM
Silly for the 40 to just sit there...and the engine, too. Might as well get them to someone who knows what they are doing and can get it running.

You never know when that TV may show up on your front porch......

:)

T


:(

I can certainly understand given that I sold my '76 because I didn't have the time to dedicate to it and it was running and all, just needed some attention to the body.

Just don't get any ideas about trying to bring that TV back :hill:

timmbuck2
09-06-2007, 10:06 AM
I guess I will be doing more of a resto than I originally planned. I am taking the time to strip and paint the engine bay as discussed a few pages back, and hopefully strip and paint the axles, frame, anything I can get my grinder on. Might as well take care of this stuff until I can get some help with the engine. Can anyone please give me some advice on what I need to get figured out before I drop the 2f in the 40? Motor mounts I need. It is a 2f with 4 speed and split t-case. I am not concerned with the parking brake yet, I know that will be an issue eventually. Thanks again for all the help and advice, especially Subzali!! :)

:bowdown::beer:

Timm

Shark Bait
09-06-2007, 10:37 AM
Tim, Just like the other thread, you'll need an FJ40 bell housing for a 2F. If no one in RS has one, you could try Ron at Rocky Mountain, Merl at Classic Cruisers or make a sweep of some of the yards. Try Joe Calleja at CTS. I don't know if Yota Yard has any of that stuff or not. You could post to IH8MUD and see if there are other Colorado guys who aren't on our board. I'd personally prefer the stock 3 or 4 speed t-case over the split case because then you could go with stock drive shafts & e-brake setup and there'll be less "rigging" of other stuff. Maybe you can trade for one.

I may have some of the motor mount stuff and you're welcome to it. We can look through what I have when you come pick up the bumper.

timmbuck2
09-06-2007, 11:08 AM
Thanks Chris, I will try to stop by soon.

I posted an ad looking for an FJ40 4-speed bell housing.

There have been tons of conflicting opinions on the tcase. I am clueless. Will have to research further.

OK, I got the grinder out over the weekend and started using a wire wheel and braided wire wheel on the rust and paint in the engine bay. The braided wire wheel gave great clean, smooth results but took forever! I slapped on a flap disk, and the sparks flew! Much quicker, but it did leave a much rouger surface. I am planning on some rattle-can primer and flat black, should I be concerned with the rougher surface? I did grab a finer-grain flap disk. Should I POR the frame and axles, at least where I can reach? Thanks!

T

Shark Bait
09-06-2007, 11:20 AM
There have been tons of conflicting opinions on the tcase. I am clueless. Will have to research further.


I'm just less of a fab guy than some. With the stock t-case & parking brake you can probably use stock drive shafts, which should be cheaper than having some made. I think I spent around $300 for a custom front shaft for the 40 I used to have. Maybe having a stock drive shaft shortened or lengthened a touch won't be quite as expensive. And then there's the brake issue. If you don't go stock, you'll have to buy a kit, or rig a cable, or maybe use a brake line lock. All do-able. :D

MDH33
09-06-2007, 11:27 AM
Something you should consider doing while you're looking for a bellhousing is to strip all the smog stuff off the 60 engine. I might recommend looking for an earlier carb as well which will be easier to set up on the desmogged 2F. You can take the air rail off the engine and get plugs (14MM 1.5 pitch plug).


Since you need to separate the engine from the trans/tc, it would be a good time for a new clutch and rear main seal too.

:thumb:

timmbuck2
09-06-2007, 11:35 AM
I heard that shortening the stock shafts would be pretty cheap....anyone vouch for that?


I'm just less of a fab guy than some. With the stock t-case & parking brake you can probably use stock drive shafts, which should be cheaper than having some made. I think I spent around $300 for a custom front shaft for the 40 I used to have. Maybe having a stock drive shaft shortened or lengthened a touch won't be quite as expensive. And then there's the brake issue. If you don't go stock, you'll have to buy a kit, or rig a cable, or maybe use a brake line lock. All do-able. :D

Martin, I think the 2f has already been desmogged, don't remember exactly what root said...need to wake him up and ask him. :)

T

Boulder Cruiser
09-06-2007, 11:36 AM
Sorry for the hi jack but when you take the smog stuff off how do you pass emissions? How much power are you gaining from it?

Shark Bait
09-06-2007, 11:40 AM
Sorry for the hi jack but when you take the smog stuff off how do you pass emissions? How much power are you gaining from it?

'75 and newer vehicles require emissions equipment. Prior to that, no emissions equipment is required. You'll have to get tested once to register the vehicle. The good news is if you apply for collector plates you don't have to test it again.

Not sure if there's any power gain, it's just a little less complicated.

You guys can send your carbs to Jim Chenowith at LC Performance (in Ohio?) to have them re-built and de-smoged. BTW, I have one out of an '82 FJ60 if either one of you needs one. :D

MDH33
09-06-2007, 11:50 AM
Martin, I think the 2f has already been desmogged, don't remember exactly what root said...need to wake him up and ask him. :)

T

That would be ideal if true. Can you take a picture or two of the engine showing the carb too? maybe we can determine exactly what you have. There is also a code on the top of the carb that can help determine what year it is.

x2 on sending your carbs to Jim C. He is the best rebuilder. However, last i heard he was several months behind schedule... I just tackled rebuilding a pair of Aisans, an early single barrel and an early 2 barrel and it wasn't too difficult. Jim goes the extra mile and tunes them for specific needs.

subzali
09-06-2007, 01:14 PM
Kindof a hijack, but what is this about an FJ40 bellhousing? Is the 60 series bellhousing a different shape that interferes with stuff?

I would look at the frame and axles and see how much rust is on them. If they look pretty bad I might consider buzzing them down and painting them, except it's hard to do with the body on and the sooner this truck gets running the better (i.e. no removing the body) so you don't run out of gas on the project. I'd probably leave it unless it's really bad.

If it were me, I would do a 2F-4spd-3spdcase combo if only for the ebrake thing at the moment, and Hatfield mentioned something about 4spd guts inside 3spd case, I don't know what that's about. The t-case isn't *all* that hard to remove later if you feel you want to go with split case.

Martin's probably right while it's out you might as well separate everything, replace rear main and clutch, then I guess it's a wash whether to stab it all as a unit or piece it together as you put it back in the truck. I guess I would take the shifters off and stab the engine, tranny and t-case all at once.

If you have good u-joints for the driveshafts, a retube/relength is about $110 give or take at Englewood Driveshaft. If you don't have the u-joints/old driveshaft it's obviously going to cost to get those.

The engine ran when it got pulled from the 60 so I would *maybe* desmog it if it hasn't already been done but I would try to get it running and then decide if the carb needs to be rebuilt or not. Like has been said Jim C. is out a few months, you could try Mark A. or a couple other places if you really wanted it done.

My :twocents:

treerootCO
09-06-2007, 01:28 PM
The engine has all the emissions installed. The parts removed were the stock power steering pump and bracket. Ige used those for her 60. There are 5 or 6 four speed FJ40 bell housings somewhere you can have for free if you can find them. If I had to guess, they are in the back of the 64LV at Zepp's place. If they are in the garage, I might be able to find one.

Shark Bait
09-06-2007, 01:40 PM
Kindof a hijack, but what is this about an FJ40 bellhousing? Is the 60 series bellhousing a different shape that interferes with stuff?


The deal is in the FJ60 there are no rear motor mount brackets attached to the bell housing. The 60 bell housing may not be threaded for the 40 mounting brackets. If you look at the picture I posted up in this thread, you'll see the mounting holes on the side of the bell housing. IIRC, the FJ60 doesn't use those, it relies on a cross member under the tranny/transfer case for rear support. Take a look at your bell housings. If the holes are there then I've been leading you astray.

Shark Bait
09-06-2007, 01:47 PM
Here are the frame comparisons. The first pic is the FJ40 frame. Note the rear mount on the PS, part #141. The second pic is the FJ60 frame. Part #150 is the cross member. Could that be adapted for the FJ40? I don't know. :D

wesintl
09-06-2007, 01:48 PM
I thought early 60's had holes for the motor mounts. If it does all you need is the motor mount steel ears and then some of the hockey puck mounts. If it doesn't then you need a bellhousing.

http://www.sor.com/sor/cat040.tam?xax=3888&page%2Ectx=cat040%2Etam

#13

MDH33
09-07-2007, 02:16 PM
Any pics of the engine/trans/tc yet? curious to see what you have to work with.

timmbuck2
09-10-2007, 03:34 PM
latest pics...bigger versions at:
http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973%20FJ40%20-%20new%20pics/

wesintl
09-10-2007, 03:54 PM
I'm not sure that would work... I'd think you'd need at least 3 holes. I think the mid late 70's had 4 iirc. You could always bolt the two and drill through and use a nut on the other end.

Might be easier to use a fj40 bellhousing though. You can replace the rear main and clutch and tranny input shaft seal too while it's out and easier :hill: Bummer. I thought it might work..

MDH33
09-10-2007, 04:30 PM
Cool to see what you're working with. Here's what I would do:

I would get that 4 speed bellhousing and replace the stuff Wes just mentioned, clutch, rear main, etc..

Strip off all that emissions stuff including the smog pump, air rail, vacuum lines, egr stuff.. Remove the ac compressor since you won't need it.

Might consider picking up an earlier FJ40 two barrel Aisan to make the de-smog cleaner (and your carb looks like it's rusty inside and 60 carbs are a pain in the rear anyway).

If you can get the '74 transfer case that will mate to the 4 speed and will have the correct parking brake drum on it, even better.

I think once you have the engine cleaned up, dropping it in will be simple. :thumb:

timmbuck2
09-11-2007, 01:56 PM
Thanks for the voice mail, I wil try and find a time to run up to Kittridge and scope out the LV at Zepp's. Maybe early next week? Thanks again.

T


The engine has all the emissions installed. The parts removed were the stock power steering pump and bracket. Ige used those for her 60. There are 5 or 6 four speed FJ40 bell housings somewhere you can have for free if you can find them. If I had to guess, they are in the back of the 64LV at Zepp's place. If they are in the garage, I might be able to find one.

timmbuck2
09-11-2007, 04:44 PM
The plan for now is to continue making the engine bay all purty, then tackle the rear main and clutch and tranny input shaft seal while I work on finding the 4 speed 40 bellhousing. Anyone know of any good writeups on the rear main and the seals? Or just RTFM? :) Thanks!

T


...You can replace the rear main and clutch and tranny input shaft seal too...

wesintl
09-11-2007, 05:03 PM
I just take **** apart and put it back together. If my short attention span or memory is eclipsed then I RTFM.

This should help though.
http://forum.ih8mud.com/showthread.php?t=99121&highlight=rear+main+seal

subzali
09-11-2007, 09:20 PM
I just take **** apart and put it back together. If my short attention span or memory is eclipsed then I RTFM.

:lmao: That was funny Wes, that sounds like me! :lmao:

timmbuck2
09-11-2007, 10:21 PM
hmm....so which manual should I have before I dive in? 80's 2f manual?

Uncle Ben
09-11-2007, 10:23 PM
The plan for now is to continue making the engine bay all purty, then tackle the rear main and clutch and tranny input shaft seal while I work on finding the 4 speed 40 bellhousing. Anyone know of any good writeups on the rear main and the seals? Or just RTFM? :) Thanks!

T

OK....I'll come clean....I have a 78 FJ-40 bellhousing I'll part with....

timmbuck2
09-11-2007, 11:02 PM
you da man! Actually, I think Boulder Cruiser could use this sooner than me, but I could pick it up if I drop by lfd270ben's place to pick up parts for people...

Thanks!!!

T



OK....I'll come clean....I have a 78 FJ-40 bellhousing I'll part with....

FJBen
09-12-2007, 09:02 AM
you da man! Actually, I think Boulder Cruiser could use this sooner than me, but I could pick it up if I drop by lfd270ben's place to pick up parts for people...

Thanks!!!

T

could you drop off my glovebox door and birf at Uncle Ben's house if you do that?

timmbuck2
09-12-2007, 09:21 AM
could you drop off my glovebox door and birf at Uncle Ben's house if you do that?

dropped it in the mail yesterday...been a little crazy around here, sorry.


T

timmbuck2
01-03-2008, 10:43 AM
OK, finally this Saturday I hope to drop the 2F into the 40 and could use help of any kind...opinions, wrench help, beer drinking help, sarcasm, taunting, etc etc. I will be starting in the late morning changing the bellhousing and probably changing the rear main seal, then trying to wrestle the whole thing into the 40. I have the front clip and 1 fender off, and I have Rezarf's cherry picker, so that should help. I think Ricardo (welcome to the club!) and Subzali were planning on dropping by late in the afternoon. Anyone else want to drop by for beers and pizza to help or just be amused at my swearing ability, feel free. Call for the address. (near University and Hampden)

Thanks!! Hopefully you will see this bad boy at a meeting some day... :thumb:

T

Thanks to all who have given me parts, tech help, encouragement, etc

:beer: :bowdown: :beer: :bowdown: :beer: :bowdown: :beer: :bowdown:

timmbuck2
01-03-2008, 11:32 AM
motor mounts...

http://www.cruiseroutfitters.com/content_images/2fMotorMount_tmb.jpg

these are the square mounts I need for a 2F, right?

I have the F motor mounts in decent shape if anyone needs them.

T

wesintl
01-03-2008, 11:36 AM
those are for the 8/80 and up... so engine side for you would work. I dunno about the frame side.. where are your rig pics again?

I might forgo snow wheelin if you guys are really going to wrench. I'd like to see you get this back on the road and feel like I owe you some help

I found your pics.. I think either would work but honestly I don't know off hand..
http://www.timmandstacy.com/1973FJ40/target53.html

timmbuck2
01-03-2008, 11:53 AM
thanks for your input Wes. I will definitely be wrenching all day. Ricardo and Subzali tell me they will be there. :) I will have the heater cranked and the beer on ice.

:)

T

MDH33
01-03-2008, 12:55 PM
Those square mounts will work up front. I'm using them in my '73 with a 2F. Wish I could come help out, but I'll be working on the new house this weekend.

RicardoJM
01-03-2008, 01:21 PM
I'm going to be there. I'm really a novice at wrenching but think this will be a great opportunity to start learning.

PatrolMan
01-03-2008, 04:31 PM
Will check with the wife about our weekend plans. Not a cruiser-head personally, but would be interested in helping/watching/learning. Done enough on other vehicles, but never an F engine... Let me know if any tools are needed. I am not too far away. Happy to let you borrow tools if I have something that might help out.

timmbuck2
01-03-2008, 04:35 PM
thanks man, not sure what tools I might need. Good to know you are nearby. :)

T

PatrolMan
01-03-2008, 05:20 PM
Mere blocks... Mostly hand tools I would assume for this job. Also have torque wrenches, air tools (if you have a compressor), 4" angle grinder, sawzall, welder, torch, bench grinder, vice, etc. Will let you know if can/not be there. BTW, I like pepperoni :D

Shark Bait
01-03-2008, 05:34 PM
Timm,

I think there was one of those square mounts in the box I gave you. I can look around for more. You might try Stevinson or Burt for the rears. Were there enough brackets to work for you in the box? Do you need mounting bolts?

I also have several distributors and coils and heater blower motors. And a radiator channel and plenty of switches and relays if you guys need anything. Sorry I can't come help Saturday.

timmbuck2
01-03-2008, 06:09 PM
I did see 1 mount in the box, have not looked closer for more.

I will call Stevinson for the rears unless anyone has extras. Not sure what I need the brackets for yet. :) I probably do need the mounting bolts.

Thanks for all the help Chris!!!

T


Timm,

I think there was one of those square mounts in the box I gave you. I can look around for more. You might try Stevinson or Burt for the rears. Were there enough brackets to work for you in the box? Do you need mounting bolts?

I also have several distributors and coils and heater blower motors. And a radiator channel and plenty of switches and relays if you guys need anything. Sorry I can't come help Saturday.

timmbuck2
01-03-2008, 06:10 PM
no real air compressor (on my to-do list)
I will make sure we have pepperoni. What is the beer consensus?



Mere blocks... Mostly hand tools I would assume for this job. Also have torque wrenches, air tools (if you have a compressor), 4" angle grinder, sawzall, welder, torch, bench grinder, vice, etc. Will let you know if can/not be there. BTW, I like pepperoni :D

Shark Bait
01-03-2008, 06:11 PM
Maybe someone with a running late model 40 can come by. It always helps me to have an example to look at. :D

Rogue Leader
01-03-2008, 06:40 PM
ive got a 74? i wont be here on saturday but would be happy to let people look at it. the F155 is close to the 2F

Rezarf
01-03-2008, 07:00 PM
Sorry Tim- my lift will have to perform my share of the work, have fun and take lots of pics!

Drew

timmbuck2
01-03-2008, 10:13 PM
Hmm....I do not want to interfere with anyone missing the snow and pizza run...how about I just work on the main seal this weekend, and we try to get a bunch of guys over next saturday? Let me know if that works better for everyone...

Thanks again!


T

MDH33
01-04-2008, 09:45 AM
Were you planning on doing the clutch at the same time as the main seal? If so, and you need parts, I have a spare SOR kit that might work for you if you're interested.

timmbuck2
01-04-2008, 09:47 AM
I probably should do the clutch at the same time, but that is very uncharted waters for me. If someone with experience wanted to help, I would go for it. If not, I will have to wait...

Thanks man!

T

Rzeppa
01-04-2008, 05:57 PM
Unless the clutch is pretty darn new, now's the time to replace it. Even if re-using the old clutch, you'll need a clutch friction plate alignment tool (or an old tranny input shaft) to hold the friction plate centered while tightening down the pressure plate.

The front square mounts do fit all years - they replace the old hockey puck style which are discontinued. Supposedly they are an improvement. I would recommend new rear mounting bolts, washers, castle nuts and cushions ("insulators" in Toyota parts jargon). It's probably too late to bring them in from the dealer though.

Having done it both ways, I highly recommend bolting the engine, tranny and t-case all together and then drop it in as a unit. Stabbing the tranny while the engine is in is easier when it's all out on the floor. It is a true PITA doing it while the engine is in.

Hint on the tranny shifter install: the retainer goes in CCW to lock it in, CW to get it out.

Another hint, when dropping the engine/tranny/t-case in, go ahead and put the alternator and water pump on in advance, it'll help counterbalance all that weight at the rear. Doing it that way, it also helps to have a load leveler for the cherry picker, and a couple of long pry bars (I use 6' sections of 1" pipe) to maneuver it in and onto the mounts.

I'll try to see if I can make it down tomorrow. In the mean time, here's some photos and narrative to help:

http://risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=1629&page=5

That starts at page 5 of 14 :-)

RicardoJM
01-04-2008, 06:17 PM
Maybe someone with a running late model 40 can come by. It always helps me to have an example to look at. :D


Chris - do you know anyone with an orange running late model 40?:cool:

timmbuck2
01-04-2008, 06:32 PM
Jeff, looks like we are delaying the engine drop until NEXT saturday. I will be working on the rear main seal during the day tomorrow if anyone wants to drop by. The pizza and beer offer stands. Hope more can make it next weekend, especially a running 40 with a 2f! :) THanks everyone!

T

Rzeppa
01-04-2008, 07:00 PM
Jeff, looks like we are delaying the engine drop until NEXT saturday. I will be working on the rear main seal during the day tomorrow if anyone wants to drop by. The pizza and beer offer stands. Hope more can make it next weekend, especially a running 40 with a 2f! :) THanks everyone!

TCool, that'll work better for me anyway, and will give you some time to bring parts in. Hopefully the write up I did on my engine freshen will help you think and plan for what else you might need to prepare for.

PatrolMan
01-04-2008, 07:40 PM
Hope that you can get the rear main and the clutch setup done. There is definately a learning curve to that, but once it is done, it is much easier. Easier to do out of the vehicle too. I also agree that if you can drop in the engine with the tranny/t-case attached, that is the way to go. Will let you know if I can stop in to put the drivetrain together. Still not sure of the plan yet. Wife wants to enjoy some sunshine tomorrow!

PatrolMan
01-05-2008, 11:21 AM
Looks like the wife has plans for us today while the weather is good. If you decide to work Sunday, she wants to go to a movie while the weather is a little crummy. Happy to miss a movie!

timmbuck2
01-05-2008, 12:27 PM
I think the main seal is pretty straight forward. I think the clutch is over my head for now. I do plan on hooking everything back together before I drop it all in.

Thanks guys!

T

Uncle Ben
01-05-2008, 01:54 PM
I think the main seal is pretty straight forward. I think the clutch is over my head for now. I do plan on hooking everything back together before I drop it all in.

Thanks guys!

T

Timm,
I just realized I never got that bell housing off and to you! I am soooooooo sorry! Obviously you found another one. :banghead: :homer:

Shark Bait
01-05-2008, 02:57 PM
I do have a bucket of large bolts I can get to you this week sometime, or you can come by Sunday afternoon.

Rzeppa
01-05-2008, 03:26 PM
Timm,
I just realized I never got that bell housing off and to you! I am soooooooo sorry! Obviously you found another one. :banghead: :homer:No prob, I fished out the BH that was in the back of Mike's 45LV on the side of my garage and gave it to him at the meeting :-)

Happy cruisin'!

Rzeppa
01-05-2008, 03:27 PM
I think the main seal is pretty straight forward. I think the clutch is over my head for now. I do plan on hooking everything back together before I drop it all in.

Thanks guys!

TPutting a new clutch in is practically zero more than putting the old one back in. The only difference is that with the new one, you have to pull the pilot and TO bearings, super-easy.

timmbuck2
01-05-2008, 03:32 PM
I like super easy things. :)

I think the main thing I am having a problem with is I just don't know the terminology well enough. I am self-taught, so everything is a do-hickey or a whatchamacalit.

I am heading out now to pull the tranny off and change the bellhousing (after I give the old one a quick paint job). I will take tons of pics and will have tons of questions. :) Thanks again all!

T


Putting a new clutch in is practically zero more than putting the old one back in. The only difference is that with the new one, you have to pull the pilot and TO bearings, super-easy.

timmbuck2
01-05-2008, 03:34 PM
Were you planning on doing the clutch at the same time as the main seal? If so, and you need parts, I have a spare SOR kit that might work for you if you're interested.

Sure, let's see if it works....

T

so, after I look through my bucket of parts from Chris, I probably need to put together a shopping list...

timmbuck2
01-07-2008, 10:32 AM
No worries man...I think someone else was looking for that bellhousing for a similiar swap, so keep it handy! :)

T


Timm,
I just realized I never got that bell housing off and to you! I am soooooooo sorry! Obviously you found another one. :banghead: :homer:

timmbuck2
01-07-2008, 10:38 AM
UPDATE:

Dang camera cable is at home, so no pics yet.


Cleaned and painted the bellhousing. THANKS Treeroot!!!!!! (and Zep!)

Got the tranny off, no problem, slid right out.

Got too cold hunkered down in the alley after the sun went behind the house, need to wrestle the dang thing inside the garage tonight.

Now I see what you mean about the clutch! So here is my new to-do list:


1. order new front motor mounts. I only have 1 (thanks Chris!) so unless someone has one of the square 2f mounts lying around, I will just order 2 new ones.

2. clutch kit. Might have to order a new one...

3. oil pan gasket?? any opinions on this? While I have it off....and it sounds like dropping the pan makes the rear main seal an easier job.

4. rear main seal (bought the PVC cleanout plug yesterday to help the job)

5. Anything I am forgetting?

Once I get this all done, I think I might be ready to drop the engine in. Would really appreciate an experienced set of eyeballs for when I put the clutch in and re-mount the tranny to the engine. Thanks for all the advice and help and parts!!


Timm

60wag
01-07-2008, 12:34 PM
Make sure you get the clutch disk in the right direction. A reoccuring question on the MUD 60s forum is, "I just did my clutch and it doesn't work. What's wrong?"

treerootCO
01-07-2008, 01:11 PM
I can almost guarantee there are motor mounts in the garage....the issue is if you can get to them...

timmbuck2
01-07-2008, 01:34 PM
I'll come over to see the kitchen and drink a beer then tackle the garage. :)



I can almost guarantee there are motor mounts in the garage....the issue is if you can get to them...

timmbuck2
01-07-2008, 04:26 PM
Anyone have a 2f in their 40 that I can drop by to take a look at and pake a few pics??

Thanks.

T

treerootCO
01-07-2008, 05:09 PM
my 40 has a 2f

MDH33
01-07-2008, 05:36 PM
Anyone have a 2f in their 40 that I can drop by to take a look at and pake a few pics??

Thanks.

T

I have a '77 2F in my '73 40. You're welcome to check it out. It's currently up in Evergreen but I'll probably bring it down to Denver sometime this week.

I also have that SOR clutch kit if you're interested. I need to double check to see if it's for a 4 speed or 3 speed. The kit comes with the clutch, pressure plate, pilot bearing, clutch centering tool and a rear main seal. The throw out bearing was not included however.

Are you using the stock three speed trans and bellhousing or a 4 speed?

corsair23
01-07-2008, 05:52 PM
Anyone have a 2f in their 40 that I can drop by to take a look at and pake a few pics??

Thanks.

T

You're welcome to crawl over mine as well...I was tempted to bring it by when you're doing your work but timing doesn't look good...

timmbuck2
01-07-2008, 06:18 PM
I have a '77 2F in my '73 40. You're welcome to check it out. It's currently up in Evergreen but I'll probably bring it down to Denver sometime this week.

I also have that SOR clutch kit if you're interested. I need to double check to see if it's for a 4 speed or 3 speed. The kit comes with the clutch, pressure plate, pilot bearing, clutch centering tool and a rear main seal. The throw out bearing was not included however.

Are you using the stock three speed trans and bellhousing or a 4 speed?

I am using a 2f, 4 speed, split tcase from a 62. If the clutch kit will work, I will take it. Let me know if you bring it down the hill.



my 40 has a 2f

Cool, another reason to drop by with a 12 pack. Preferred brand?



You're welcome to crawl over mine as well...I was tempted to bring it by when you're doing your work but timing doesn't look good...

Let me know a good time to crawl. :)



Thanks guys!!

Timm

Rzeppa
01-07-2008, 06:24 PM
Sure, let's see if it works....

T

so, after I look through my bucket of parts from Chris, I probably need to put together a shopping list...The only difference would be between a 4-speed kit and a 3-speed kit. The 2f Throwout bearing is larger, the pressure plate is a totally different design, and the friction plate is different.

Rzeppa
01-07-2008, 06:36 PM
3. oil pan gasket?? any opinions on this? While I have it off....and it sounds like dropping the pan makes the rear main seal an easier job.

4. rear main seal (bought the PVC cleanout plug yesterday to help the job)

5. Anything I am forgetting?

Once I get this all done, I think I might be ready to drop the engine in. Would really appreciate an experienced set of eyeballs for when I put the clutch in and re-mount the tranny to the engine. Thanks for all the advice and help and parts!!

Timm
3. The rear main seal doesn't care whether the pan's off or not, the job is the same. Unless the current one leaks, leave well enough alone. They are totally separate jobs.

4. It should although I've always done it the "hard" way and tapped gently all around with a rubber shot-filled hammer and try to keep it square on the way in.

5. RTV sealant, nitryl gloves, solvent, bucket and brush to clean stuff (if you don't have a parts washer, no idea how I ever did anything without one), lots of rags. Brake fluid for the clutch M/C-slave. Safety goggles for working underneath. FSM!

When you order in parts, don't forget new bolts and washers for the motor mounts. Old ones are often corroded, especially the rears.

And as I mentioned, the load leveler is really handy when dropping the whole thing (engine/BH/tranny/t-case), the assembly's really heavy in the rear in this configuration.

Rzeppa
01-07-2008, 07:28 PM
I am using a 2f, 4 speed, split tcase from a 62. If the clutch kit will work, I will take it. Let me know if you bring it down the hill.
TimmHuh? A 1962 has a 3-speed and solid case, and FJ62 (USA spec anyway) is an automatic tranny. I am guessing you mean FJ60?

In any event, there is another consideration, VERY IMPORTANT! The stock 3 speed clutch slave is on the driver's side of the BH, the stock 4 speed slave is on the passenger side! This is among several reasons that when I did my 4 speed conversion on my 71 I kept my 3 speed clutch.

You will need to re-route the hardline for the clutch hydraulic line over the firewall to the passenger side for the 4 speed clutch. Many parts stores sell pre-flared hydraulic tubing in various lengths. You'll probably want to measure the length the tubing will need to go, then buy some tubing and a bender for this. IIRC, the later master and slave will be M10x1.00 threads, with 3/16" OD tubing. My 71 was a different thread (British IIRC) with 1/4" OD hardlines, and when I replace my clutch M/C some time ago I had to graft the two systems together.

See my write-up here (http://rzeppa.org/tech/clutchmc.htm) on using a later clutch master with my existing 71 plumbing. The older clutch masters where the original plumbing would thread right up are discontinued.

timmbuck2
01-07-2008, 08:19 PM
Sorry...the 2f, 4spd, and split tcase all came from Root out of a donor FJ60, they were all together in the FJ60.

I noticed last night that the 4spd clutch was on the "wrong side". Sigh. More work. :)

T

Huh? A 1962 has a 3-speed and solid case, and FJ62 (USA spec anyway) is an automatic tranny. I am guessing you mean FJ60?

In any event, there is another consideration, VERY IMPORTANT! The stock 3 speed clutch slave is on the driver's side of the BH, the stock 4 speed slave is on the passenger side! This is among several reasons that when I did my 4 speed conversion on my 71 I kept my 3 speed clutch.

You will need to re-route the hardline for the clutch hydraulic line over the firewall to the passenger side for the 4 speed clutch. Many parts stores sell pre-flared hydraulic tubing in various lengths. You'll probably want to measure the length the tubing will need to go, then buy some tubing and a bender for this. IIRC, the later master and slave will be M10x1.00 threads, with 3/16" OD tubing. My 71 was a different thread (British IIRC) with 1/4" OD hardlines, and when I replace my clutch M/C some time ago I had to graft the two systems together.

See my write-up here (http://rzeppa.org/tech/clutchmc.htm) on using a later clutch master with my existing 71 plumbing. The older clutch masters where the original plumbing would thread right up are discontinued.

Rzeppa
01-07-2008, 09:33 PM
Sorry...the 2f, 4spd, and split tcase all came from Root out of a donor FJ60, they were all together in the FJ60.

I noticed last night that the 4spd clutch was on the "wrong side". Sigh. More work. :)

TThat's okay Timm, I was trying to thing of the "gotchas" beforehand.

Speaking of gotchas, what all smog gear and ancillaries does this 2F from the 60 come with? Carb, air cleaner, manifolds and head are all lots different from a 73 F...

corsair23
01-07-2008, 11:51 PM
Let me know a good time to crawl. :)

Most nights I'm home Timm with the girls, usually after 6:00pm so just let me know if you're wanting to come by :thumb:

I've got some "extra" stuff hanging off my engine (OBA) and non-OEM carb (Weber) but otherwise it is pretty stock. My tranny however is an SM420 if that matters regarding what you are wanting to see.

treerootCO
01-08-2008, 10:02 AM
Sorry...the 2f, 4spd, and split tcase all came from Root out of a donor FJ60, they were all together in the FJ60.

I noticed last night that the 4spd clutch was on the "wrong side". Sigh. More work. :)

T

You can flip it over to the other side without any issues. The fork rotates, the piviot has the hole drilled and tapped, and the bellhousing has a cutout on both sides for the fork.

timmbuck2
01-08-2008, 10:28 AM
I was wondering about that...cool! Thanks!

T



You can flip it over to the other side without any issues. The fork rotates, the piviot has the hole drilled and tapped, and the bellhousing has a cutout on both sides for the fork.

Rzeppa
01-08-2008, 09:35 PM
You can flip it over to the other side without any issues.The main issue is routing the hydraulic line. Secondary are whether the threads fit :-)

farnhamstj
01-08-2008, 10:43 PM
Dealing with the hydraulic line was much easier than I expected. I borrowed a flairing tool and had no problems making what I needed with hand full of premade lengths from Carquest. I had to mix & match but nothing leaked when it was all done. I did brake lines from MC to caliper.

Rzeppa
01-09-2008, 09:48 AM
Dealing with the hydraulic line was much easier than I expected. I borrowed a flairing tool and had no problems making what I needed with hand full of premade lengths from Carquest. I had to mix & match but nothing leaked when it was all done. I did brake lines from MC to caliper.I've made my own too, but have been surprised to learn that many times, the pre-made lengths are cheaper than buying the tubing and fittings separately.

timmbuck2
01-09-2008, 07:29 PM
got the motor inside. thanks Subzali and Ricardo!

taking off the bellhousing...I assume I need to spin the flywheel around to get to all the bolts on the clutch cover, correct? guess I need to spin the crank? I am such a newbie with the 2f. :)

T

Rzeppa
01-09-2008, 09:16 PM
got the motor inside. thanks Subzali and Ricardo!

taking off the bellhousing...I assume I need to spin the flywheel around to get to all the bolts on the clutch cover, correct? guess I need to spin the crank? I am such a newbie with the 2f. :)

TYou will need to remove the flywheel to get at the BH bolts, yes. You can get all 6 flywheel bolts off through the hole in the back of the BH. Note the locking plates, you need to flatten them to get the bolts off. Use a big screwdriver and hammer for that. Air impact is best to get the bolts off, but barring that, you'll need to hold the flywheel from turning if you use hand tools. Use a big screwdriver or prybar on the teeth to hold it.

timmbuck2
01-09-2008, 09:19 PM
Hmm...flywheel is NOT moving. Cannot get to all the clutch bolts.

You will need to remove the flywheel to get at the BH bolts, yes. You can get all 6 flywheel bolts off through the hole in the back of the BH. Note the locking plates, you need to flatten them to get the bolts off. Use a big screwdriver and hammer for that. Air impact is best to get the bolts off, but barring that, you'll need to hold the flywheel from turning if you use hand tools. Use a big screwdriver or prybar on the teeth to hold it.

timmbuck2
01-09-2008, 09:31 PM
hmm....how bad is it that I cannot even budge the flywheel??? that seems bad to me....

Shark Bait
01-09-2008, 10:03 PM
hmm....how bad is it that I cannot even budge the flywheel??? that seems bad to me....

Did you try pulling the plugs? Have you tried a crowbar on the flywheel? :D

timmbuck2
01-09-2008, 10:04 PM
will pull the plugs next...someone has not brought my crowbar back from when I left it at the kiosk. ;)

Shark Bait
01-09-2008, 10:07 PM
will pull the plugs next...someone has not brought my crowbar back from when I left it at the kiosk. ;)

You can borrow mine when you come by tomorrow night. :D

Rzeppa
01-09-2008, 10:53 PM
No matter how fantastic the compression is, you don't need a crowbar to turn the flywheel, with or without plugs. A large screwdriver or small to medium sized pry bar works fine.

Did the engine run when it was pulled?

timmbuck2
01-09-2008, 10:58 PM
I could not budge it with my hands...I will go try a screwdriver, but it feels pretty stuck. Treeroot said it was running when it was in the FJ60...maybe he has more info.

Shark Bait
01-09-2008, 11:06 PM
Yeah, a BF screwdriver should work, too. :D

Uncle Ben
01-09-2008, 11:07 PM
I could not budge it with my hands...I will go try a screwdriver, but it feels pretty stuck. Treeroot said it was running when it was in the FJ60...maybe he has more info.


More than likely you have some rust on the rings/cylinders. It's probably not much. I would squirt some PB blaster or even a cap full of ATF in the spark plug holes and let that sit for a day or two. Then try to turn it and feel for roughness. Even if it has been sealed from the elements the surface rust on the shiny bare cylinders is common. When a running engine sits for a long time the oil on the cylinders disappears and the moisture in the air will attack. Is rarely done but any engine that has been run should get a couple squirts of oil in all cylinders if it's gonna sit for a long time!

timmbuck2
01-09-2008, 11:13 PM
More than likely you have some rust on the rings/cylinders. It's probably not much. I would squirt some PB blaster or even a little ATF in the spark plug holes and let that sit for a day or two. Then try to turn it and feel for roughness. If it has been sealed from the elements the surface rust on the shiny bare cylinders is common. After the oil has disappeared the moisture will attack.


good point, I will go do that now....it is 10:30....I am a freak....

Uncle Ben
01-09-2008, 11:21 PM
good point, I will go do that now....it is 10:30....I am a freak....

Oops...your quick! I edited my post you quoted....

timmbuck2
01-09-2008, 11:23 PM
told ya I was a freak. :)

timmbuck2
01-10-2008, 12:24 AM
pulled the plugs and squirted some PB in there. we will see. I could not budge the flywheel with a BF screwdriver. I am concerned...

Uncle Ben
01-10-2008, 12:48 AM
pulled the plugs and squirted some PB in there. we will see. I could not budge the flywheel with a BF screwdriver. I am concerned...

Look in the sp holes with a flashlight.....if you can see any rust or the "orange milk of death" your gonna have to pull the head and check it out! :(

MDH33
01-10-2008, 05:13 PM
"orange milk of death" :(

I laughed when I created a mental image of the beast who's teet this must come from. :D

But I'm bummed to hear that the 2F might need further surgery. :(

subzali
01-10-2008, 05:20 PM
Free 2F on Craigslist...

timmbuck2
01-10-2008, 11:12 PM
doesn't look good. sprayed PB Blaster in there 5 times in the last 24 hours. used a crow bar, BFH screwdriver, etc. and nothing. put the propane heater on it for an hour to make sure it was nicely thawed out, and nothing. all cylinders look pretty good, but #1 has a little orange sludge. Mike says it was running fine when it was taken out of the fj60.

any other ideas? I am stuck. and bummed.

Chris. thanks for that crank, but there was no place to put it.....


thanks everyone

Shark Bait
01-10-2008, 11:16 PM
Chris. thanks for that crank, but there was no place to put it.....


Bummer, Timm. On a 2F from an FJ40 the nut on the crank pulley has some "tabs" for the manual crank.

Sounds like it's time to go shopping. :rolleyes:

Uncle Ben
01-10-2008, 11:40 PM
all cylinders look pretty good, but #1 has a little orange sludge.
any other ideas? I am stuck. and bummed.

thanks everyone

Oh please nooooo...orange sludge (orange milk of death) is not good! It got water in it from sitting outside and it reacted with the aluminum pistons and the steel cylinders! You have to pull the head! With luck it's hasn't been in it long enough to pit the cyl walls too deep or corrode the rings to the piston! Maybe it's not that bad but at this point you really need to pull the head and make sure! Sorry Timm!

timmbuck2
01-10-2008, 11:50 PM
Oh please nooooo...orange sludge (orange milk of death) is not good! It got water in it from sitting outside and it reacted with the aluminum pistons and the steel cylinders! You have to pull the head! With luck it's hasn't been in it long enough to pit the cyl walls too deep or corrode the rings to the piston! Maybe it's not that bad but at this point you really need to pull the head and make sure! Sorry Timm!



WAY over my head. Guess I need to start looking for another 2f, or go get that running FJ40 in Billings. Sigh.

timmbuck2
01-11-2008, 01:01 AM
So thanks for all the help offers for Saturday, but if I cannot even get the crank to turn to take off the clutch and flywheel, we won't have much to do but drink beer and BS. Hmm...

Anyway, if any engine expert wants to peek in my spark plug holes, feel free to drop by. :) I guess I will start looking for a new 2f.

Thanks again everyone!!!

T

subzali
01-11-2008, 12:28 PM
Pulling the head is not hard, just pull the intake and exhaust manifolds and then untorque all the head bolts in order. I might be able to swing by for a quick minute around 4 or so today if you'll be home.

timmbuck2
01-11-2008, 12:44 PM
thanks, not sure when I will be home. should get it on a stand, don't like it swinging around. :) I can probably find the head bolt order on Mud or the 2f manual?

timmbuck2
01-11-2008, 01:57 PM
things can't get any worse....my tcase and tranny were stolen.

Now all I need is an engine...and tcase..and tranny. Exactly where I was 8 months ago.

subzali
01-11-2008, 01:59 PM
Nakari has a tranny, Farnham did (does?) have a tranny and t-case, and there's the engine on Craigslist. I'm not sure if any of it is still available...

timmbuck2
01-11-2008, 02:02 PM
The F155 is mine if I want it on CL. The 2F I will call about again. The 2F I already have is probably in better shape than either of those engines. If I catch those )*^#*#.......

Rzeppa
01-11-2008, 02:18 PM
I don't know whether these engines can be put on a stand with the BH still on - I've always taken it off to mount it to the stand using the BH holes in the block.

Another tack might be to pull the pan. You can whack on the crank with a large rubber mallet to get it unstuck. With the head off, you can whack on a piston top with a section of 2x4 and small sledge. In either case, pick a piston which is halfway through it's travel for maximum leverage on getting the crank to turn.

I've got a couple spare pan gaskets if you decide to pull the pan.

Sorry to hear about the tranny and t-case - what happened?

I have a spare 3-speed tranny and t-case if you're interested.

Rzeppa
01-11-2008, 02:21 PM
thanks, not sure when I will be home. should get it on a stand, don't like it swinging around. :) I can probably find the head bolt order on Mud or the 2f manual?I've never been concerned with order when removing head bolts, only when putting the head back on. But yes, the order for torquing them down will be in the 2F manual.

gr8fulabe
01-11-2008, 02:59 PM
doesn't look good. sprayed PB Blaster in there 5 times in the last 24 hours. used a crow bar, BFH screwdriver, etc. and nothing. put the propane heater on it for an hour to make sure it was nicely thawed out, and nothing. all cylinders look pretty good, but #1 has a little orange sludge. Mike says it was running fine when it was taken out of the fj60.

any other ideas? I am stuck. and bummed.

Chris. thanks for that crank, but there was no place to put it.....


thanks everyone

Instead of PB Blaster, try using Mark Whatley's home made Anti-seaze formula. That stuff rocks & I have successfully used it on an F engine that was seized. Someone here on the board should have the receipe. It is more or less equal parts of 4 things (ATF, & three otheres, but I don't recall what). It might help...

Uncle Ben
01-11-2008, 03:36 PM
Instead of PB Blaster, try using Mark Whatley's home made Anti-seaze formula. That stuff rocks & I have successfully used it on an F engine that was seized. Someone here on the board should have the receipe. It is more or less equal parts of 4 things (ATF, & three otheres, but I don't recall what). It might help...


If it has "sludge" that would be the same category as liquid which is not compressible and forcing it to move could end up creating a bigger problem! Pulling the head is the ONLY way to know whats going on and could end up saving quite a bit of $ in the long run!

corsair23
01-11-2008, 03:49 PM
Timm,

If it helps I've got some FJ40 manuals at home - I think I've got a 2F engine manual and other stuff. I'm not using them at the moment so you're more than welcome to borrow what you need. I can look tonight and let you know exactly what I have if you'd like :thumb:

Sorry to hear about the theft - Bastids! :mad:

timmbuck2
01-11-2008, 04:14 PM
If it has "sludge" that would be the same category as liquid which is not compressible and forcing it to move could end up creating a bigger problem! Pulling the head is the ONLY way to know whats going on and could end up saving quite a bit of $ in the long run!

so running the starter motor would be a bad idea???

Rzeppa
01-11-2008, 05:17 PM
so running the starter motor would be a bad idea???NO! Not a bad idea. I am quite sure (Kevin please correct me if I am misunderstanding your post) that what Kevin is referring to is hydrolock, where water/liquid gets into the combustion chambers when a rig gets dunked for example. This would not apply in this case since you've already removed the spark plugs. With the plugs out, there's no way to get hydrolocked.

To reply to a separate reply, Mark Whatley's magic formula includes ATF, kerosene, mineral spirits and diesel fuel IIRC. Or at least 3 of those 4, and I do remember it has 4 ingredients.

Uncle Ben
01-11-2008, 05:19 PM
so running the starter motor would be a bad idea???

Leave the plugs out!

gr8fulabe
01-11-2008, 06:06 PM
Leave the plugs out!

That actually goes to my next question...

Only the top part of the cylinder builds compression, right? The reason I ask is from above, when you mentioned the, "orange sludge" not being compressible.

If the plug was out, wouldn't turning the motor over just push it out through the plug hole? So, would the risk be to the bottom half of the motor, or does it just not push enough out to elminate risk to the piston/rings, etc...?

Just curious, & thanks in advance for the info!

Best,
Abe

timmbuck2
01-11-2008, 06:09 PM
plugs are out, ATF was added at lunch. Jeff and I will be testing the starter tomorrow. :)

Rezarf
01-11-2008, 07:27 PM
Sweet! I have a compression tester if it would be of any help, Stacy and I are hitting up that RV show tomorrow and will be at the convention center downtown if you'd like it.

might let you "see" whats going on in there compression wise.

Rzeppa
01-11-2008, 07:34 PM
That actually goes to my next question...

Only the top part of the cylinder builds compression, right? The reason I ask is from above, when you mentioned the, "orange sludge" not being compressible.

If the plug was out, wouldn't turning the motor over just push it out through the plug hole? So, would the risk be to the bottom half of the motor, or does it just not push enough out to elminate risk to the piston/rings, etc...?

Just curious, & thanks in advance for the info!

Best,
Abe"Orange Sludge" refers to the buildup of oxidation that can occur between the cylinder walls and the piston rings on engines that have been sitting around a while. In particular, the rings can get mated to the walls with oxidation. It doesn't take much for them to become pretty stuck in my experience, yet it doesn't take much to get them unstuck, and no harm is really done after the engine is run as long as there is no significant pitting on the cylinder walls.

After my conversation with Timm today, I learned that all of this is being done while the motor is still hanging from chains on a cherry picker: hardly good for leverage. You can't get a good perch from tweaking the flywheel teeth with any kind of levering device.

Since all the ancillaries (dist, fuel pump, manifolds, etc.) are still on the engine, it isn't practical to lay the engine down, especially on it's side for better leverage. Then it struck me that with the starter still bolted on, it would get excellent leverage to turn the crank. It's bolted to the bellhousing, which is bolted to the engine. On top of that, a 60 starter is of the gear reduction vintage, further adding to the possibility that it could budge the crank.

Simply jump the starter solenoid activation contact with the big one that runs the starter, then hook up jumpers from a good battery. The worst that could happen is that something bad might happen (probably to the starter itself) on an engine that already had issues, no?

So anyway, to answer gr8fulabe's question, no as long as the plugs are out, there is no risk from hydrolock. Any fluid in the combustion chambers has a pathway out. If the motor's seized from some other reason, it really doesn't matter, it will need to be torn into anyway. BTW, I have a few spare cranks and cams laying around if anyone needs them :-)

timmbuck2
01-12-2008, 12:15 AM
If anyone wants to see if anything explodes, Jeff and Ricardo are coming over around 10. Too early for beers, but I will work on breakfast burritos or pizza for lunch...

:)

T

timmbuck2
01-12-2008, 02:50 PM
SHE LIVES!!!!!!!!!!!!

I guess I was just being too gentle. :) After Ricardo and I put the 2f on the floor motor stand (Thanks Turtle60!!!) we started looking for the starter while waiting for Zepp. Guess what. NO starter. (Anyone have a 2f starter???!) That brought my morning down a little. Then Zepp showed up and with some pry bar action we were able to spin the flywheel. YES! Off came the clutch, flywheel and bellhousing, quick rear main seal change, and put the new bellhousing back on. Now waiting to get a clutch kit, pick up the 4 speed from Nakari (THANKS! I will call and come by after naptime) and just find a tcase and I can start thinking of dropping this beast into the 40. HUGE thanks to Jeff Zepp and Ricardo for their help. After cursing humanity after mt tcase and tranny were stolen, I have been overwhelmed by the kindness of the Rising Sun crew....offers for engines, trannys. tcases, help, etc. have flooded my email and phone. Thanks to all! I can't wait to help you out on your next project.

I am sure Ricardo will post pics up, he was the photographer today. :)

Thanks again everyone!

Timm

Rzeppa
01-12-2008, 05:26 PM
I am sure Ricardo will post pics up, he was the photographer today. :)



I'll look forward to the pix, and maybe any video Ricardo may have shot ;-)

Yes, there was certainly some rust in the cylinders, but nothing too serious. Once the first 20-30 of rotation was accomplished, it started turning normally. Getting that first budge was key.

I've worked on 60s here and there over the years, and it never ceases to amaze me the miles of vacuum spaghetti those rigs have. I definitely would want a factory emissions manual to figure out what's safe to plug off and what is still needed. In particular, I would want to make sure the charcoal canister functions more or less properly.

I advised Timm to leave all the ancillaries on the front to help counterbalance the weight of the tranny and t-case when the assembly is hoisted in. I've never paid attention to this, but does anyone here know if the stock *60 A/C compressor is useful for OBA?

Speaking of starters, I have about three dead non-gear reduction starters laying around, if anyone wants one to rebuild or for a core, free to club members. They might also be useful to hold tarps down ;-)

Shark Bait
01-12-2008, 05:34 PM
I've never paid attention to this, but does anyone here know if the stock *60 A/C compressor is useful for OBA?


Yes. In my 55 I used the FJ60 front motor mount that was also the bracket for the stock A/C compressor. We also used the alternator bracket(s) from the 60. IIRC, we needed the lower radiator hose and connector pipe from the 60 as well, to clear the belts. Oh, we also needed the 3-groove pulley from the 2F from the 60, but that may already be on Timm's motor. You'll need to put an oiler on the intake for the compressor, but it worked great!

Turtle60
01-12-2008, 05:53 PM
Ige has some starters for sale on the Ih8mud site. I have a 38mm tcase from an '87 fj60 that I've been trying to get $200 for for awhile. Trying to save up for a couple new parts and pay for those longfields I just put in.

RicardoJM
01-12-2008, 06:54 PM
Timm, I'm happy to know the engine is alive.

I've posted up some pictures and video's (http://picasaweb.google.com/Ricardo.Maestas/Timmbuck2) from this afternoon. Hope you enjoy them.

I really learned quite a bit from the experience and look forward to doing some more stuff.

Jeff your knowledge and experience really saved the day. All too often simple things are difficult to comprehend until you see them practiced by an experienced person and then they become clear and obvious. Thanks for letting me learn.:thumb:

Rzeppa
01-12-2008, 07:02 PM
Nice! Spider web poop does not cause rear main seals to deteriorate though :-)

Rzeppa
01-12-2008, 07:14 PM
Passing thought...Timm...you will need a 60 series or compatible ignitor to work with the 60 series fully electronic distributor...

timmbuck2
01-12-2008, 07:25 PM
and some lock tite for the flywheel? :)


So, think I was a *little* happy when the flywheel came off?

timmbuck2
01-13-2008, 10:17 AM
Were you planning on doing the clutch at the same time as the main seal? If so, and you need parts, I have a spare SOR kit that might work for you if you're interested.

Do you have the earlier or later kit? This is the one I need:

http://www.sor.com/sor/partpict.tam?xax=2510&itemnum%2Ectx=018%2D19B%2DKIT&itempict%2Ectx=%2E%2E%2Fshared%2Fimage%2F018%2D19B%2DKIT%2Dbig%2Ejpg&item%2Ectx=018%2D19B%2DKIT&page%23%2Ectx=018&itemnumdesc%2Ectx=Clutch%20Assembly%20Kits%20%26mdash%3B%20Gasoline&catpage%2Ectx=cat018%2Etam%23018%2D19B%2DKIT&itemnumtext%2Ectx=Specter%20offers%20a%20complete%20Clutch%20Replacement%20Kit%20with%20all%20the%20parts%20one%20would%20need%20to%20do%20a%20complete%20clutch%20job%2E%20Specter%20provides%20only%20high%20quality%20clutch%20components%2E%20We%20only%20use%20new%20Asco%20brand%20heavy%20duty%20clutch%20pressure%20plates%20%26%20heavy%20duty%20clutch%20discs%2E%20Asco%20is%20the%20Japanese%20manufacturer%20of%20the%20Toyota%20factory%20O%2EE%2EM%2E%20clutch%20components%2E%20We%20also%20provide%20high%20quality%20Japanese%20brand%20throw%20out%20bearings%20and%20pilot%20bearings%2E%20Specter%27s%20Kit%20also%20includes%20a%20Japanese%20brand%20rear%20engine%20seal%2C%20two%20O%2EE%2EM%2E%20hub%20clips%2C%20and%20a%20clutch%20alignment%20tool%2E%20Kit%20%23018%2D19B%2DF%2DKIT%20comes%20with%20a%20resurfaced%20flywheel%2E%20In%20our%20experience%20these%20are%20all%20the%20parts%20one%20should%20need%20to%20replace%20to%20do%20a%20proper%20clutch%20job%2E&pagetitle1%2Ectx=Page%20018&pagetitle2%2Ectx=Clutch%20Components&descriptionpg%2Ectx=Page%20018%20Clutch%20Components

I also need 1 more motor mount unless I can dive through Mike's garage and come out alive!! :)

T

subzali
01-13-2008, 10:55 PM
Looking good Timm!

timmbuck2
01-24-2008, 09:19 PM
OK, could really use some help this weekend just getting the engine out. I will work on getting everything unhooked and the engine attached to the cherry picker, but could use some muscle getting it out of the pig. Anytime you could help for an hour or so would be awesome. Pizza and beer of course. Thanks.

Timm

RicardoJM
01-25-2008, 09:29 AM
I'm up for getting the engine and transmission out. TheBoomBoom has to work Saturday afternoon. Which day and what time are you thinking you need the muscle?

timmbuck2
01-25-2008, 09:32 AM
Any time....Saturday morning works, but let me know when you are working on your shackles, I will come over to help. Can't leave Saturday afternoon but can work in the garage while Ty sleeps. Got all the lighting and 'new' heater installed in the garage last night. I had to turn the darn thing down, I was sweating out there when it was 20 outside!

T

RicardoJM
01-26-2008, 11:41 PM
Wow, the engine is out:beer2:. That turned out to be a bit longer than an hour. I'm glad we got the engine out. Thanks for the dinner and letting me and Rick hang out to give you a hand. Now it should be a straightforward deal to put the engine in.

timmbuck2
01-27-2008, 10:47 AM
Thanks for all your help and hard work! Without you and Rick I would still be out there yanking on stuff and throwing tools. :) Now to get the garage cleaned up, and loosen the shackle bolts so I can get the axles off. Oh and put in a new header in the kitchen and move some electrical wiring. Who said weekends were boring? :)

Thanks again Ricardo.

T

timmbuck2
01-30-2008, 11:35 PM
OK...time for an update. Thanks for consolidating my numerous build threads.

If you followed my other threads, this is just a recap. :)

Let's see where I left off...ok, I had the 2f, 4 speed and split tcase from the FJ60. Moved the engine inside to replace the rear main seal and the clutch. 24 hours after moving the engine inside the garage to work on it, the tranny and tcase were stolen from the alley next to my garage. Then I could not get the flywheel to budge and spent a couple of days squirting PB Blaster and ATF in the spark plug holes. Thankfully I was just being too nice and with some help from Zepp and Ricardo I got the rear main seal replaced. I also got the correct bellhousing from Root. Then I started looking online for a new tcase, and saw a $400 FJ55 advertised down in Walsenburg. After a little negotiating, I was heading down there with Ige and Ricardo to pick it up. After a LOOONG day (where we also discovered NO tcase) we got it back to my garage where I spent a week pulling parts. Then spent a whole day with Ricardo and Rick getting the engine and tranny out. Ige then picked up the carcass for the scrapyard. In the process discovered the rear axle on the 55 had a locker! Score!! I still did not have a tcase, but after a little trading with Max, I have a 3 speed tcase. Tonight I was able to get the clutch and flywheel and bellhousing off. This 2f has a flywheel MUCH easier to move! I have a rear main seal on the way and a clutch kit on order.

Here is my plan for this beast...first things first, I want to get her running ASAP. As soon as I replace the rear main seal and clutch I will work on getting the engine, tranny and tcase in the truck. While I am waiting for the clutch I will finish cleaning up and painting the engine bay. Once the engine is in place, and running, it will need a few things to get on the road...battery, gas tank, driveshafts fitted, adjust brakes, run new lines to the 4 speed clutch, new exhaust, some other minor things. :) The next step after getting her on the road is to get the 55 axles under her. I want to spend a little time cleaning them up and POR 15 them both. Once I get them on and find a proportioning valve for the disc brakes and all the brakes re-done, I will have a disc brake front and a locked rear. Beefy axles from the 55 and maybe the leafs will go on with the axles as well. Hopefully at least the lift from a certain someone's axle package. :) Then some new 33's, and I might be ready for Moab and/or Rubithon. :rolleyes: I am sure there are 100 things I am still forgetting, but this is the plan for now. Oh, and some sliders from SROR. :cool: Major thanks to everyone who has helped out, either wrenching or picking up trucks or advice or anything...especially Root, Ige, Ricardo (and Rick), Subzali, and Zepp!!!

All advice, scorn, laughter, encouragement, and skepticism is warmly welcomed. See you Southsiders tomorrow night and the rest of you next Wednesday.

Timm

Shark Bait
01-30-2008, 11:48 PM
Sounds good, Timm! You will need the conversion input gear for your 3-speed t-case to mate to the 4-speed tranny. Looks like TPI has an adapter kit (http://www.tpi4x4.com/OverhaulKits.html). :D

timmbuck2
01-30-2008, 11:50 PM
Sounds good, Timm! You will need the conversion input gear for your 3-speed t-case to mate to the 4-speed tranny. Looks like TPI has an adapter kit (http://www.tpi4x4.com/OverhaulKits.html). :D

ARGH!!!!!

OK, I will put in the 3 speed and tcase originally from the 40 and find some time to work with Chris to put my other 3 speed gears in the 4 speed tcase??

Shark Bait
01-30-2008, 11:52 PM
ARGH!!!!!

OK, I will put in the 3 speed and tcase originally from the 40 and find some time to work with Chris to put my other 3 speed gears in the 4 speed tcase??

It's OK. You can put the 3-speed t-case on the 4-speed tranny. I would do that and swap the case later. Just get the conversion kit from TPI. You'll be happier with the 4-speed tranny. My :twocents:.

timmbuck2
01-30-2008, 11:57 PM
It's OK. You can put the 3-speed t-case on the 4-speed tranny. I would do that and swap the case later. Just get the conversion kit from TPI. You'll be happier with the 4-speed tranny. My :twocents:.

Adapter kit is $195!! 3 speed tranny and tcase are in the back of my 40 and free. Overhaul kit to put the 3 speed gears in the 4 speed case is ~$150?

Shark Bait
01-30-2008, 11:59 PM
Adapter kit is $195!! 3 speed tranny and tcase are in the back of my 40 and free. Overhaul kit to put the 3 speed gears in the 4 speed case is ~$150?

You'll need the adapter kit no matter what for the 4-speed tranny to 3-speed t-case. :eek: :D The bell housing is different for the 3-speed tranny and the 4-speed tranny. If it was me, I'd go with the 4-speed tranny and 3-speed t-case. Freshen them up and you're set.

timmbuck2
01-31-2008, 12:01 AM
Even if I just use the 3 speed tranny and 3 speed tcase??

Then if I put the 3 speed gears in the 4 speed tcase I would need BOTH the $195 kit PLUS the $150 overhaul kit??

Think I will just find a 4 speed tcase.


Of course then I lose the emergency brake....right?

Shark Bait
01-31-2008, 12:04 AM
Even if I just use the 3 speed tranny and 3 speed tcase??

Then if I put the 3 speed gears in the 4 speed tcase I would need BOTH the $195 kit PLUS the $150 overhaul kit??

Think I will just find a 4 speed tcase.


Of course then I lose the emergency brake....right?

No. Sorry, I was editing my post. The bell housings are different. I was under the impression the later flywheel & clutch went with the later transmission, and the older with the older. Someone else may know what the valid combinations might be.

Shark Bait
01-31-2008, 12:06 AM
Think I will just find a 4 speed tcase.

Of course then I lose the emergency brake....right?

You lose the e-brake with the "split" t-case. '79 (?) and later? '75-'78 t-case has the e-brake drum, as do the 3-speed t-cases. :D

Rzeppa
01-31-2008, 12:29 AM
Timm already has the "early" 4 speed bellhousing courtesy of Mike. If he wants to just bolt the 4 speed tranny to the 3 speed t-case he has most of the parts he needs, but probably not the transition gear and B210 bearing. I think Joe Calleja charged me around $70-90 or so for the gear. Bearing was something like $10-15 at NAPA? That might be the quickest way to get the rig driving. From memory, the transition to split case was late 1980, August or so?

timmbuck2
01-31-2008, 08:34 AM
OK...keeping with the quickest/cheapest build plan, I will look for a 4 speed tcase. If I can't find one in the next week or 2, I plan on going with the 3 speed tranny and tcase.

Hmm...that 55 in Cheyenne has a 4 speed................

Shark Bait
01-31-2008, 08:47 AM
Hmm...that 55 in Cheyenne has a 4 speed................

This is how it started for me over 10 years ago. :eek::lmao:

timmbuck2
02-04-2008, 04:24 PM
OK, now I find out the flywheel is different for each tranny? So I have two 2f engines that had 4 speeds mounted to them, so my 3 speed tranny has a different input shaft that will not fit the 2f/4speed flywheel. So I either need to find a 4 speed tcase, put my 3 speed gears in Hatfield's 4 speed case, or buy a new flywheel...

treerootCO
02-04-2008, 05:49 PM
That is completely independent from the flywheel. What you are referring to is the pilot bearing.

timmbuck2
02-04-2008, 06:06 PM
That is completely independent from the flywheel. What you are referring to is the pilot bearing.

ahh, ok, that makes more sense, and I am replacing the pilot bearing with the clutch anyway. the input shaft teeth hit the clutch, not the flywheel...

Shark Bait
02-04-2008, 07:25 PM
OK, now I find out the flywheel is different for each tranny? So I have two 2f engines that had 4 speeds mounted to them, so my 3 speed tranny has a different input shaft that will not fit the 2f/4speed flywheel. So I either need to find a 4 speed tcase, put my 3 speed gears in Hatfield's 4 speed case, or buy a new flywheel...

Keep the 2F, bell housing, flywheel & clutch, 4-speed tranny all together. Get the conversion input gear to mate your 3-speed t-case to the 4-speed tranny and you are set. :cool:

Rzeppa
02-04-2008, 08:05 PM
OK, now I find out the flywheel is different for each tranny? So I have two 2f engines that had 4 speeds mounted to them, so my 3 speed tranny has a different input shaft that will not fit the 2f/4speed flywheel. So I either need to find a 4 speed tcase, put my 3 speed gears in Hatfield's 4 speed case, or buy a new flywheel...
The input shaft of both the 3 speed and 4 speed trannies are the same, and so is the pilot bearing (crank is the same from F to 2F). AFAIK, all 4 speed flywheels are the same, but must be used with 4 speed pressure plate and friction plate. The throw out bearing, bearing retainer, fork and fork pivot needs to match the pressure plate and flywheel you're using. You can use either 3 speed or 4 speed clutch parts on the 4 speed bellhousing from personal experience, my speculation is that you could probably use them on the 3 speed bellhousing too.

The output shaft of the 3 speed and 4 speed are different (ten versus 16 splines IIRC?).

Rzeppa
02-04-2008, 08:12 PM
Keep the 2F, bell housing, flywheel & clutch, 4-speed tranny all together. Get the conversion input gear to mate your 3-speed t-case to the 4-speed tranny and you are set. :cool:In addition to the input gear, I also needed the Datsun B210 bearing for the input shaft, and had to fabricate some spacers. One spacer for the PTO gear on the inside, and another one for the space between the rear of the input shaft and where the washer/nut goes onto the rear of the tranny output shaft to snug against the bearing inside race. Neither the stock 3 speed spacer nor the stock 4 speed spacer would fit. Four of the five bolts for the 3 speed that hold the t-case to the tranny were not long enough to thread into the 4 speed tranny. The threads are recessed a half inch or so and I had to steal them off my 76 and then get new ones from Stevinson for it. Timm should have plenty of long-enough bolts from his two 4 speeds though.

timmbuck2
03-12-2008, 10:27 AM
It's a date. Zepp, Subzali, and Ricardo (theboomboom??) will all be helping this Sunday to drop the 2f from Uglibus into my 40. Yay! :) Thanks SO much for the help guys. Anyone else who wants to drop by to watch, heckle, drink beer, eat pizza, call Ricardo a 'candy ass', or steal an F engine block from my alley, please feel free to come! PM me for directions in South Denver near DU. You can also take a look at the ultra rare 1968 Aerodynamic FJ40!!! :rolleyes:

Thanks again to all for their help, parts, patience, advice, etc. I can't begin to tell you how much I appreciate it.

T

Shark Bait
03-12-2008, 08:01 PM
Timm,

If I wasn't going to be on a plane to Indianapolis I'd be there. Sounds like you've got some good help. :D

subzali
03-12-2008, 08:30 PM
Word. Reckon I'm gonna enjoy this! I'm gonna bring over some wheel cylinders too, maybe we can unfreeze a couple :D

theboomboom
03-12-2008, 11:12 PM
i'm down

Rzeppa
03-13-2008, 07:44 PM
Word. Reckon I'm gonna enjoy this! I'm gonna bring over some wheel cylinders too, maybe we can unfreeze a couple :D

O-A torch. I don't think Timm has one but it can work. Obviously, the o-rings will be shot after the torch treatment, but you were going to rebuild them anyway, right?

timmbuck2
03-15-2008, 08:52 AM
Going through my stuff and I thought I had decent rear motor mounts,
bolts, washers and cotter pins....and now I don't think I do. I know we broke one of the bolts from the 55 when we took it out. Anyone happen to have anything I could use tomorrow???? Thanks...

:beer::beer::beer:

T

Rzeppa
03-16-2008, 11:09 PM
Heh. After scrounging up hardware and motor mount and assorted trial and tribulations, we posed for a group shot...Landing the Big One :-)

nuclearlemon
03-16-2008, 11:35 PM
uh...isn't it supposed to be IN the cruiser?:confused:

subzali
03-17-2008, 08:04 AM
It was about 15 minutes later :D. That was a lot of fun guys! Kinda too bad we had to go back to the 3spd tranny/tcase for now, but like you said Timm, getting the engine in is huge in order to get the thing on the road!

RicardoJM
03-17-2008, 08:45 AM
The engine is in. This one went in a whole lot smoother than it was coming out of the piggie. Echoing what Matt said, it was bunch of fun working with you guys yesterday afternoon. I'll see about getting some pictures posted up this evening. Now that the engine is in, Timm is one step closer to getting his FJ40 on the road.

MDH33
03-17-2008, 09:14 AM
Good work guys!

Nothing wrong with a 3 speed. :thumb:

Uncle Ben
03-17-2008, 10:22 AM
Good work guys!

Nothing wrong with a 3 speed. :thumb:

Other than the gearing and possible 3-on-the-tree shifter. :rolleyes:

timmbuck2
03-17-2008, 11:08 AM
Other than the gearing and possible 3-on-the-tree shifter. :rolleyes:

The tranny and tcase were original to this 40.

THANKS THANKS THANKS!!! you guys ROCK!

:risingsun:

Cannot tell you how much I appreciate alllll the help! Ty had a great time riding his trike around the garage with the "big guys". He was sad when you all left. :) Thanks a million, cannot wait to get the Baby Blue Beast out of the garage...

T

Rezarf
03-17-2008, 12:35 PM
:risingsun:

Great job fellas, what a cool thing to see a 40 return to life! :D :woot:

Rzeppa
03-17-2008, 08:22 PM
uh...isn't it supposed to be IN the cruiser?:confused:

Heh. After we "landed" the big one, we put it in the cooler :-)

RicardoJM
03-17-2008, 08:38 PM
Here is a link (http://picasaweb.google.com/Ricardo.Maestas/Timmbuck2F) to the pictures from my camera yesterday. Jeff, Matt, Timm and Rick - it was great working with you guys.

Shark Bait
03-17-2008, 08:40 PM
Way cool guys. What's all that spaghetti? :D

timmbuck2
03-18-2008, 09:31 AM
Way cool guys. What's all that spaghetti? :D

Absolutely no idea. Wanna come help figger it out? ;)

T

MDH33
03-18-2008, 11:54 AM
Absolutely no idea. Wanna come help figger it out? ;)

T

Timm, I can bring my 40 over sometime if you want compare. I have essentially the same setup. De-smogged 2F mated to a 3speed. (it passes emissions without any smog gear). The only difference is that I have an earlier carb.

timmbuck2
03-18-2008, 11:59 AM
Timm, I can bring my 40 over sometime if you want compare. I have essentially the same setup. De-smogged 2F mated to a 3speed. (it passes emissions without any smog gear). The only difference is that I have an earlier carb.

Please!!! Would love to compare and take pics....anytime!!

timmbuck2
03-18-2008, 12:04 PM
To-Do List for Moab: (only 4 working weekends for me)

-Get Engine Running and desmogged.
-driveshafts
-exhaust
-check and probably overhaul brakes
-maybe..swap in FJ55 axles...rear locker (no brake cylinders right now) and front disc brakes...which would mean more brake work
-hopefully install lift and front locker
-sliders. IF SROR is not too swamped. :)
-seats
-gas tank
-1 afternoon to paint the fender I stripped and various other touch ups
-new tires


Oh, and my kitchen remodel is not quite done.

Oh, any my wife is 3 months pregnant.

Oh, and work is crazy.



So what again does my 80 need for Moab? Nothing really.........

T

Shark Bait
03-18-2008, 12:33 PM
My take would be to rip most of it out. :D



Please!!! Would love to compare and take pics....anytime!!

timmbuck2
03-18-2008, 01:14 PM
My take would be to rip most of it out. :D

Just happens to be a 78 2f desmog thread on Mud....and my 2f is from the 78 FJ55... :bowdown:

http://forum.ih8mud.com/40-55-series-tech/121581-layout-78-2f-desmog.html

T

Rzeppa
03-18-2008, 06:28 PM
To-Do List for Moab: (only 4 working weekends for me)

-Get Engine Running and desmogged.

check

-driveshafts

Since you didn't do the 4 speed conversion, you should be able to just bolt up your old ones

-exhaust

check - Note that OEM muffler/tailpipe is (was) still avaiable from dealer for about the same (inexpensive) $$ as aftermarket muffler shops, and it bolts right up!

-check and probably overhaul brakes

check

-maybe..swap in FJ55 axles...rear locker (no brake cylinders right now) and front disc brakes...which would mean more brake work

fuggetaboutit. Not enough time

-hopefully install lift and front locker

Not necessary AND not enough time with the rest of the list

-sliders. IF SROR is not too swamped. :)

Don't really need 'em on a 40 - that's mainly a wagon thing

-seats

check - Make Ricardo buy you some $10 covers where he ripped the old ones ;-)

-gas tank

check

-1 afternoon to paint the fender I stripped and various other touch ups

check - less than a whole afternoon to shoot some quickie rattle can primer on it. You can come back and do it up nice after rust repair, right?

-new tires

maybe - size is more important than tread on the slickrock. Put that down the list some :-)

Oh, and my kitchen remodel is not quite done.

Restart that the weekend after Moab :-)

Oh, any my wife is 3 months pregnant.

Is she coming to Moab with you and Ty?

Oh, and work is crazy.

That's one of the things Moab is for - fuggetaboutit!

nuclearlemon
03-18-2008, 07:03 PM
[QUOTE]Quote:
Originally Posted by timmbuck2
-maybe..swap in FJ55 axles...rear locker (no brake cylinders right now) and front disc brakes...which would mean more brake work

fuggetaboutit. Not enough time[QUOTE]
i gotta disagree there. before you do driveline, just swap the rear pumpkin (if you're hustling, figure about an hour, two if you're screwing off). the front axle swap complete, before you do the brakes since you'll have the brake lines off and you'll be pulling a valve out of the master cylinder, and buy a set of ubolts ahead of time ($60-75). figure on about three hours since getting the spring center pins to line up often requires a come along between the springs. ;)

Hulk
03-18-2008, 07:12 PM
Don't really need 'em on a 40 - that's mainly a wagon thing

SLIDERS: I agree with Jeff...for Moab.

Before you run the rock garden at Spring Creek, make sure you have sliders for your 40. Unlike Bill Morgan, you can ask me how I know. :rolleyes: