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Red_Chili
11-20-2007, 10:23 AM
While seemingly silly to go to a 4x4 board for advice on Photoshop, I know you freaks spend quite a bit of time doing this stuff and know it well. So...

I want to get Forrest set up with Photoshop. He is an incredible artist, using pencil and pen media. He barely can find his way around on a computer, but he is doing better. I am told he really needs to get conversant with Photoshop, so off I go googling... EEEEEK!!! Not only prices, but SHEESH, how in the world do I decide what to get him? I am thinking BASIC here, just to get his feet wet and edit simple images, not necessarily movies or animation.

Another complication: I am loathe to buy a Mac. I used to be a Mac devotee, but since then all I have done is PCs. We already have one office with one computer (besides my laptop) and I am not thrilled with the idea of plunking MORE money down on a new computer - and where to put it? And I get to support it when my wife and kid inevitably blow something up? Not exciting.

Yet lots of artist friends say, Mac rules. For this purpose however, the software is the same, no? New monitors should make things equal. New CPU, if necessary, should do likewise. Currently running 1GB memory on a 1.6GHz box, WinXP.

Please advise o trusted ones.

Rezarf
11-20-2007, 10:47 AM
I think Photo Shop makes a program called Elements... it is a stripped down home user version for a lot less bank. I love the full blown Photoshop, I had a few classes on it in college and I know how to use roughly... .0334% of the Big program.

Just my .02

treerootCO
11-20-2007, 10:48 AM
Photoshop CS is not as expensive if you buy it through a local college. Approx $1000 off retail. You need at least Adobe CS3 Design Premium. I would not suggest Elements but if you want to try it, I have about ten or so licensed copies you can have.
http://www.newegg.com/product/product.asp?item=N82E16832105315

A 32" flat screen would help as well. More real estate is always better. Buy the book, it helps as well. I have a few old ones if you want to start there.

Here is another good example....http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116134 349 retail...approx 60 at the Regis bookstore.

Mac vs PC is anyone's guess. DO NOT BUY VISTA 64bit. It is not compatible with Photoshop! (yet)

Red_Chili
11-20-2007, 11:00 AM
Wow, Element sounds exactly like what he would need just to start. Let me know how to get the program and book from you. Then, if he takes to it, we can upgrade (while he is still a student of cour$e). So you agree, a Mac may be nice but not really all THAT much nicer?

Shark Bait
11-20-2007, 11:37 AM
Any of you guru's want to do a "Getting Started" informal workshop?

timmbuck2
11-20-2007, 11:53 AM
oooh! I would supply the beer for that workshop!! Always wanted some more practice with it...

treerootCO
11-20-2007, 11:58 AM
I can learn you, just let me know.

Red_Chili
11-20-2007, 11:58 AM
What a great way to get Forrest started! His B-day is December 14, so are you thinking sometime after that? If I get him Element, will that be pretty close to what he needs?

Beater
11-20-2007, 12:02 PM
photoshop is the most difficult thing I ever tried to learn... it is not to be taken lightly. I would HIGHLY recommend the acc course on it, or other community course. It's an incredible program.

It will even turn out cad files (qxf and others)

nakman
11-20-2007, 12:13 PM
Have you already ruled out the Gimp? total free open source, and it looks like those guys went to a lot of trouble to make the controls just like PhotoShop. I'm running 2.2.8 here at work and I like it a lot, looks like they're on a newer version now http://www.gimp.org/

But if Forrest were to get good at Gimp, those skills would be immediately transferrable to the real deal Photoshop. Kind of like learing to wheel a J##P, later once you get behind the wheel of a real truck you'd probably do pretty good... not the same product but the basics are all still there. :lmao:

IMO, download him the Gimpshop today, then later when he takes a class in Photoshop he'll probably find his way to a student version, and will be way ahead.

DaveInDenver
11-20-2007, 12:21 PM
Have you already ruled out the Gimp? total free open source, and it looks like those guys went to a lot of trouble to make the controls just like PhotoShop. I'm running 2.2.8 here at work and I like it a lot, looks like they're on a newer version now http://www.gimp.org/

Funny, I'm running 2.2.13 here. I have Adobe CS at home (educational version) and GIMP is pretty similar to the real thing. It's good enough and definitely worth the price, anyway.

Chris
11-20-2007, 12:39 PM
Another complication: I am loathe to buy a Mac.


Get a new Mac and you can run your PC stuff on it too.
Windows XP and Leopard on one machine, too cool. :cool:

:cheers:

Red_Chili
11-20-2007, 01:08 PM
I was a Mac devotee so I know the genuflection. Not for a while. No issue with the quality. The money to buy one, however...
So would Gimp, or Element be close to Photoshop?

treerootCO
11-20-2007, 01:12 PM
Gimp is freeware - open source stuff. Elements is like Photoshop but does not have the full functionality. It is like having a 4-wheel drive and removing the front drive shaft.

Red_Chili
11-20-2007, 01:17 PM
Which would be a better intro to 'driving' Photoshop? Forrest is to computer geek as I am to ... to ... Chinese.

Chris
11-20-2007, 02:14 PM
Elements for sure. It's Photoshop Lite which is good for an introduction. Doesn't have all the features of PS but most people don't use all of them anyway.

nakman
11-20-2007, 02:27 PM
cost of Elements = cost of Elements + Gimp.

MIB! ;)

Chris
11-20-2007, 03:20 PM
I bought Elements on Amazon for $19 a while back when Adobe was offering a $30 rebate.
Cost = $11.00 in my pocket. :D

nuclearlemon
11-20-2007, 03:33 PM
i've got elements, but it won't work on my computer. i have to keep changing settings for my monitor or something. f'n computers:rolleyes:

RockRunner
11-20-2007, 09:40 PM
My vote would be for Gimp if you don't want to but CS3, Elements is fine but I would say it is closer to a 1/4 of PS or CS2-3. I may still have a valid copy of PS 5.5, if I do you are more than welcome to borrow it.

Like John said PS is one of the hardest programs to learn and keep up at. If you walk away from it for a while it will take a while to get back to the level you were. Any training you can get is a big plus and as I am tyoing this I just remebered that I have a DVD that teaches you how to use CS1 or 2. You can borrow that too if you want.

Let me know, you know how to reach me ;-)

PS two 19" monitors work great for PS

Red_Chili
11-21-2007, 08:39 AM
Actually, 1/4 of PS would be desirable. The cost of Elements plus Gimp might be Forrest walking away because it is all overwhelming!

Very informative. Root, let me know how to get Elements from you. And y'all, let me know when / where the class is!

Uncle Ben
11-21-2007, 09:09 AM
And y'all, let me know when / where the class is!

Bill, I assure you, you have more class than you could ever get from one of "us all!" ;)

Red_Chili
11-21-2007, 10:05 AM
[snort]
That is a sad commentary on the rest of y'all!! :lmao:

Hulk
11-26-2007, 01:20 AM
I'm pretty adept at Photoshop as well. I'd be glad to be Mr. Root's assistant teacher in a Photoshop class.

To be a true illustrator on the computer, you'll need to learn more than Photoshop. It would be good to learn Adobe Illustrator as well. Photoshop is pixels; Illustrator is vectors. The two programs have started to overlap somewhat, but it's still a good idea to know both of them.

Start with Photoshop. Illustrator is even harder to learn, IMHO.

Mac vs. PC -- I no longer have a preference. I have one of each on my desk. The program is the same. You can get nearly every font for either machine, and usually the same fonts will work on either platform these days. If you have a PC, it is certainly not necessary to buy a Mac to learn Photoshop. The key commands are the same on both platforms, so if he wants to switch at some later time, he won't have to relearn the program at all.

It's also not necessary to use the latest version of Photoshop to learn the program. Look on eBay, and you can usually find earlier, fully licensed versions that will work really well. I would say that Photoshop 5.5 and newer would work just fine -- I think I''ve used every version since Photoshop 4.0.

The student versions are a great deal. A friend of mine who is a professional photographer took some Photoshop and Design classes, and used a web site to buy the software at bargain prices. He just faxed them a copy of his current student ID and then they fulfilled his order. If you want, I can ask him what web site he ordered from.

Red_Chili
11-26-2007, 07:41 AM
Great info! My wife who heard that a Mac was far superior (one from an Apple salesman, and another from an artist Mac devotee, go figger) will be comforted to know that.

My boss is a student currently and he is happy to purchase what I need for Forrest, since obviously Forrest is still a student. Root, I would like to figure out how to get the copy of Elements from you, maybe at the next meeting?