View Full Version : Blackstone Report...

02-12-2008, 12:30 AM
Ok, so this is the first one I have had done. This is for the '97 FZJ80.

What do you all think? It seems like a good report and I'm assuming Blackstone doesn't just sugar coat the comments right? I'm probably like many 80 owners that are just waiting for their HG to go but it doesn't appear that is likely in the near future based on this. And, this seems to corroborate what most say about running Mobil 1 syn 5K miles or more with no worries. Of course it takes us about 7+ months to drive the FZJ80 5K miles so I think I'll stick with just changing the oil etc. every 6 months and keep an eye on it...


05-28-2009, 05:47 PM
I'm still doing the Blackstone oil analysis...I guess I'm a little :eek: about my HG going in either the 80 or the LX. I thought my fellow 80 series owners might be interested in seeing the results. I ran the oil ~3 months longer than I meant to (:doh:) but it doesn't seem to have mattered. Had to add 2 qts of oil over the 9 months so not bad (seems to be about average). Funny how the mileage between changes ended up where it did...You'll understand that if you are a Colorado native :hill:.

If you're interested, the oil I've used is: For the first and second reports I was running Mobil 1 0W/40 - For this latest report I was running the Mobil 1 10W/40 High Mileage oil. While it might seem that my oil burn increased, in fairness I added 1 qt of oil just before CM09 and probably didn't need to but I wasn't positive when I was going to get around to changing the oil...

Bottom line for me is that changing the oil in the 80 every 6 months is fine (given the mileage it sees in that time) AND more importantly it looks like I can hold off for a little while longer on placing that call to Robbie to get on his calendar for a HG replacement :cool:


05-28-2009, 11:22 PM
That's cool stuff! I have no idea what "good" numbers are though, did you have to fast first?

05-29-2009, 02:48 AM
No fasting required :hill: - As for what are good numbers, that is probably something one could find at BITOG but I'm good with consistency...

05-29-2009, 07:34 AM
Please explain more about Blackstone reporting - it looks/sounds like they take a sample of your used oil and do an analysis on it. How much does that cost? How do you get the sample to them? What all can they tell from the analysis?

05-29-2009, 11:10 AM
It's about $22 a sample. They send you a free kit in the mail (couple bottles, zip lock, etc. for a secure mailing), and you send them a small sample of the oil. You can see on Jeff's report that they have national benchmarks for your engine that they compare against, plus they'll comment on anything else you ask about or they observe (such as the TBN).

I think your first submission is good for checking you against the overall benchmarks, but from then on out each additional submission gives you numbers to trend against the baseline you set on your own rig. So you can see trends or problem areas that appear over time specific to your rig.

I don't send mine in on every oil change, but I check in every 15k or so to see how things look.

Air Randy
05-29-2009, 11:53 AM
I've used Blackstone for many years on all of the various diesel rigs I have owned. I found that I could routinely go 10,000 miles between oil changes using regular 15w40 with plenty of safety margin. In fact, I could just change the filter at 10,000 miles and add 2 qts for what was lost in changing the filter and easily go another 5,000 miles with plenty of safety margin (adequate additives left with minimum particulates and fuel).

I routinely got 200,000 plus miles out of all those motors with zero failures. The ones I know of are still running fine without any major repairs.

Everyone has their own opinions and if changing your oil every 6 months or 5,000 mile is what makes you comfortable, then that is what is right for you. But, if you use the oil test reports on a regular basis you will find you can go much farther between changes with complete safety, especially when you're using the expensive synthetic stuff.

05-29-2009, 02:27 PM
maybe I'll try it on the 60 the next time I change the oil. I tend to wait kind-of a long time between changes on that thing.

05-29-2009, 05:01 PM
Everyone has their own opinions and if changing your oil every 6 months or 5,000 mile is what makes you comfortable, then that is what is right for you.

I'm just getting over the "beaten into my head" rule that you MUST change your oil every 3mos/3k miles whichever comes first :hill: - small steps...

One thing I take into consideration is type of driving and both my 80 and LX see mostly city driving, thus the low miles over a relatively long time.

12-16-2011, 09:37 AM
Hot off the press in California:

12-16-2011, 04:17 PM
^I'm fine with that. So many people are ignorant to these details on their cars and I don't like the jiffy lubers taking advantage of people. People can still make their own decision, but nothing wrong with getting the correct information propagated.

12-16-2011, 07:22 PM
Changing your oil every 3,000 makes mother earth and baby jesus cry.

I change the oil in my KTM (1L) every 10 hours. I'm going to hell.

Cool report Jeff, thanks for sharing. I'm gonna start sending in the KTM oil in the summer. Be nice to know if I can run longer between intervals.

12-18-2011, 10:25 AM
Great find on that article, I'm going to post that on the CLC forum.

I remember when that whole "3000 miles or every three months" thing was cooked up as oil change shacks started popping up all over the U.S.. I think that was a marketing ploy for them, sad what it has done for the environment. I follow my vehicle's manual, typically 7,500 mile intervals. With all the vehicles I have around here, I'd kill myself trying to keep up with all of them at 3,000 mile oil changes.

01-12-2012, 04:12 PM
I remember reading that article when it came out, but as you can see from my sig line, my newest cruiser is my 1987. I have an F engine getting hot tanked and machined as I type this, but still wonder if my oil change schedule by following my decades-old factory manuals is too aggressive?

I guess it costs a lot more than $22 to buy the 8 quarts plus (OEM) filter to change the oil in one of my F or 2F engines, so what the heck, I should probably get mine tested. My FJ60 is within 100 miles of it's normal change interval, was gonna do that this weekend. How many ml or oz. do they need for a sample?

01-12-2012, 04:15 PM
I think the bottle they supply is around 4 ounces.

Uncle Ben
01-12-2012, 05:02 PM
I don't use Synthetic engine oil and I do and will continue to change oil and filter every 3-4k! If you do a lot of highway miles and chock up a lot of miles rapidly then you can go longer. If you short trip a lot, drive in dusty environments and or do not let you engine warm up before driving then short interval changes are your engines best friend! Flame on....

01-13-2012, 10:54 AM
FWIW, I run M1EP for ~12k between changes both in the 80 and the 100, change both vehicles every February and sample each change w/ Blackstone.

Anecdote: I've had my 80 a long time. After I drained the oil from the 80, I would put the used oil into my beater commuter car, a 1996 Ford Probe. Started doing this in 1999 when the Probe was 3yo. Sold the Probe last year (2011) at ~260k miles and drove like the day we bought it. 37mpg as long as you didn't turn on the AC, what was I thinking?

In total, every quart of the EP probably got 20k miles use.

01-13-2012, 11:19 AM
I don't use Synthetic engine oil and I do and will continue to change oil and filter every 3-4k! If you do a lot of highway miles and chock up a lot of miles rapidly then you can go longer. If you short trip a lot, drive in dusty environments and or do not let you engine warm up before driving then short interval changes are your engines best friend! Flame on....
Oh dear... I am in agreement with UB... :eek:

Except I run synthetic and run longer intervals... but yeah, city driving with rapid heat/cool cycles and little time to boil off contaminants is hell for engines.

01-13-2012, 11:22 AM
If I don't change the oil in my KTM (1L) every 10 hours. I'm going to repair shop hell.
Fixed it for ya...
That darn motor has GOT to be the most hellish on oil that is out there... rapid temp cycles, little capacity, meager filtration, synthetic REQUIRED just to meet service limits... it would be really interesting to see a Blackstone report on it. I would bet, after 10 hours, it would have lots of viscosity breakdown and metal contaminants.
Hey this is cool, I get entertainment at the expense of Farnham's $22.
Works for me...

06-27-2012, 01:16 PM

And here we are talking about 5-6K mile intervals :D

We’re anonymous here, so we’ll call the characters in this true story “Dad” and “Sonny.” Dad doesn’t believe in oil changes, so Sonny “borrowed” the truck one day and got us a sample. Sonny told his dad the truck was leaking oil in his driveway while he was unloading stuff from Home Depot (it wasn’t), so while he had it he “fixed” the leak and changed the oil.

Dad grumbled and said he should have left it alone, but agreed it was time. This is factory oil in Dad’s 1997 Nissan pickup truck with 122,635 miles on it. And you know, for an oil that’s been in place as long as this one has, the oil doesn’t look half bad.

It was thick, like a 15W/40. Fuel was present, though without trends we don’t know if that’s a temporary thing or if it’s always present. Bearing wear (copper, lead, and tin) is heavy, as is upper-end wear (aluminum and iron), but the rings (chrome) are wearing well. Sonny says the engine starts easier now and it isn’t as labored as it was when it runs. We’re not sure if these results are a testament to Nissan’s engineering or Dad’s good driving, but either way, next time you get worried that it’s been six months since you changed your oil, you can remember Sonny and Dad and breathe a little easier!


06-27-2012, 01:34 PM
I rebuilt a motor (toyota paseo) that had 160k and no oil changed ever in it once.

It looked pretty much like thick brown reddy whip.

It had whatever oil in it the dealer sold it with.

It had a spun rod bearing that ran until the piston hit the head and messed more stuff up.

06-27-2012, 01:41 PM
Here is the report I did on the 60 a while back. This was after 4200 miles on the oil with 160k on the motor.

06-27-2012, 05:29 PM
^ I like how you impressed the tech with your engine swap. :cool:

06-28-2012, 11:20 AM
I've always liked the "personal" touch the Blackstone folks tend to put into their notes. Not the typical canned responses :thumb:

06-28-2012, 11:52 AM
I thought it was entertaining too. I wonder how big the company is or how big the section that does this stuff is.

02-13-2013, 11:36 AM
just got mine. First one so the next will be telling. I asked a question and they replied, so here it is (I have not yet heard on my follow-up question:

Hi Amanda,

A super-slow coolant loss was found and resolved in two external leaks (a hose clamp and a overflow bottle cap) the level is now stable for several weeks and we highly doubt internal coolant contamination. After the rebuild I ran Valvoline Premium Conventional SAE 5W-30 for the first 1,000 miles and then switched to the Mobil 1. I do not know what oil was used in the block before my rebuild and since we did not touch the bottom end, it could be additive from prior oils.

As for the metals, my rebuilder, who specializes in Land Cruisers wrote: "I am wondering if they could of mixed this up with some one else, copper is not used in the bearings, none of the rods or mains. Even the one in the block for the oil pump is aluminum and not brass. Curious that is. I would opt to wait for the next sample to see what is up."

I did several 4x4 trips to Utah and there was plenty of dust.

-----Original Message-----
From: Amanda Callahan
Sent: Tuesday, February 12, 2013 7:14 AM
Subject: RE: Oil Report on FZJ80-011913 (our lab number F40868)

Thanks for the question. It's because of the presence of sodium in your report. Sodium is a marker for antifreeze, though it can also be additive in certain oils. Mobil 1 doesn't use sodium, so if you've been using that oil for a long time, then the sodium could be coolant. If you've recently changed oils, then the sodium could be additive. Since this is just one sample, and we're not sure what was used in this engine in the past, we put a question mark in the coolant place. We should know better next time.

Amanda Callahan
Blackstone Laboratories

At 06:54 AM 2/12/2013, you wrote:
>Thank you. Can you tell me why there is a question mark for antifreeze?

02-13-2013, 02:16 PM
Daniel, if you are interested I could send you the reports from both the LX and the 80 as a comparison. I'm down to doing just one a year, usually in the spring so I'll have the next round of reports in a couple months. I like that you can see trends, if they exist, over time.

02-13-2015, 04:15 PM
Here is mine: accidently changed the oil on the 80 without putting it in the sample bottle, so decided to use it on the 40. Will catch the 80 next time around. I had added a note that I thought I might have put ZDDP into the oil but couldn't remember, so they are confirming that it did not have ZDDP additive in it. I later found the bottle that I thought I had put in.

http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/uploads/subzali/FJ40/Blackstone Report 2015-2-13 - Copy.png

08-01-2015, 08:54 AM
From the 80: