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RicardoJM
12-15-2008, 08:02 AM
How did everyone who keeps their cars outside do with getting them started this morning?

I couldn't get the 40 to turn over this morning:(. It started yesterday morning (1 degree) and again in the late evening (0 degree) but could not get it done this morning (-6 degree). So, I drove the 100 series in to work today.

Azrael
12-15-2008, 08:12 AM
I haven't tried this morning yet, but it's in the garage today. I had it sitting outside until 9ish last night and it started just fine. The bigger problem for me was getting it up to running temp. After sitting for a few minutes in the lot, and driving for ~15 minutes, it was still stuttering a bit.

Uncle Ben
12-15-2008, 08:30 AM
How did everyone who keeps their cars outside do with getting them started this morning?

I couldn't get the 40 to turn over this morning:(. It started yesterday morning (1 degree) and again in the late evening (0 degree) but could not get it done this morning (-6 degree). So, I drove the 100 series in to work today.

Ohhhhh....such a sacrifice! ;) :lmao: My 80 is outside and fired up with ease this morning but the heater motor definitely was screaming out for help for a few minutes.

treerootCO
12-15-2008, 08:59 AM
The 80 started fine with just the one battery. My heater woke the neighbours with it's banshee whining.

DaveInDenver
12-15-2008, 09:01 AM
I bit the bullet and switched to synthetic on the last oil change (about a month ago). As slow as the engine cranked the past couple of mornings, I'm sure that made the difference in go/no-go.

Now if I could only solve the leaking anti-freeze issue. That's not new, but seems worse when it's cold. Which doesn't make sense because it starts leaking after driving for a while and so it doesn't seem to be just shrunken hoses or whatever. I put 15 psi on the cooling system Saturday morning and found a slightly loose hose clamp, but once I snugged that down it held 15 psi for at least 1/2 an hour with no drop in pressure or new drips. It's really irritating because I don't want to be killing neighborhood cats and wildlife if they decide to lick the coolant off the frame rail or the pool that forms on the skid plate. It seems like it might be concentrated around the upper radiator outlet or along the top tank-to-core seam. But since it's intermittent and only when completely hot, it's a PITA to figure out and I don't have a spare radiator to try. Old trucks...joy.

Heater? Ha. Set on full hot, fan at 11, the 22R-E doesn't make enough heat to warm the cab AND keep ice from condensing on the inside of the glass. So it is with a massive 125HP I guess at -5F.

MDH33
12-15-2008, 09:07 AM
My mini truck with the non-operational choke is a no-go. Drained the battery trying. I hooked up the charger and opened up the aircleaner to operate the choke by hand. Got it started, but couldn't move it because the clutch seems frozen. It goes to the floor and feels normal, but I cannot get it into any gear. :confused:

The 40 and 60 always start, but the 60 power steering always groans in the cold.

DaveInDenver
12-15-2008, 09:14 AM
My mini truck with the non-operational choke is a no-go. Drained the battery trying. I hooked up the charger and opened up the aircleaner to operate the choke by hand. Got it started, but couldn't move it because the clutch seems frozen. It goes to the floor and feels normal, but I cannot get it into any gear. :confused:

The 40 and 60 always start, but the 60 power steering always groans in the cold.
Do you have any detectable change in the engine sound when you push in the clutch? Like it is working less hard? I find with my truck that when it's below freezing and certainly when it's around 0F and lower that the transmission and transfer lube are so thick that the synchros are not spinning and it feels like I'm trying to row through Jello. So I put the transfer in neutral, tranny in 4th and let the drivetrain spin at idle for a few minutes, seems to warm up the gear lube enough that I can actually shift and I'm even running Redline synthetic in the tranny... It's also possible that the clutch master or slave are marginal so that when they are cold the seals are shrunk and you aren't moving any fluid.

60wag
12-15-2008, 09:15 AM
This morning I was NOT missing my old carburator. Fuel injection rocks.

subzali
12-15-2008, 09:28 AM
My '91 truck did okay this morning, letting the clutch out almost stalled the engine though - 90wt in the tranny is pretty thick when it's this cold. I have to double clutch shift when it's this cold, before the tranny warms up. It was stop and go traffic on the interstate and about two miles up the interstate (so about 10-15 minutes) it was warm enough inside I could have taken my coat, gloves and hat off and been comfortable.

My 40 seems to start better when it's really cold out (choke all the way out, two pumps on the gas, about 1 second firing and BOOM there she blows), though i don't have it with me to try it this morning :( The heater will just take the edge off the cold, though, during the short commute that I have, given the size of the cabin and the lack of insulation :rolleyes:

nakman
12-15-2008, 09:44 AM
The Scout started yesterday to plow, that was a nice surprise. The pump the gas a few times, pull the choke out, wait 10 seconds, turn the key method isn't just for 40's anymore...

The 80 started too, but with a louder than normal start-up zing. Is that the heater motor? I always thought it was power steering, but the sound is still there even now that I've got a brand new PS pump... :confused:

Uncle Ben
12-15-2008, 09:46 AM
The Scout started yesterday to plow, that was a nice surprise. The pump the gas a few times, pull the choke out, wait 10 seconds, turn the key method isn't just for 40's anymore...

The 80 started too, but with a louder than normal start-up zing. Is that the heater motor? I always thought it was power steering, but the sound is still there even now that I've got a brand new PS pump... :confused:

Front pumps in the auto tranny can make that same sound for the same reason.

nakman
12-15-2008, 09:52 AM
I actually made a .wav of it years ago during a discussion on mud. This is the sound we're talking about, right? startup zing! (http://risingsun4x4club.org/uploads/nakman/startup_zing.wav)

rest of you 80 guys get this?

nuclearlemon
12-15-2008, 10:35 AM
i just went outside and turned the key. i love fresh battery

FJBen
12-15-2008, 11:02 AM
I'm driving the 87 Dodge Ram 50 carburated with a bad battery fired right up. That thing actually amazes me...always starts. It sat outside because the new toy is inside. :D

wesintl
12-15-2008, 11:38 AM
First time I've ever had a diesel problem. I most likely have a frozen fuel line between the tank and the filter. I was able to get a few miles down the road on just the fuel in the filter. It started just fine though at -7

Dammit.

Jenny Cruiser
12-15-2008, 12:47 PM
I actually made a .wav of it years ago during a discussion on mud. This is the sound we're talking about, right? startup zing! (http://risingsun4x4club.org/uploads/nakman/startup_zing.wav)

rest of you 80 guys get this?

All but one of mine has made that noise when it's cold. It was -20 out here this morning and it was worse than usual when I fired it up a bit ago. Is it the power steering or the heater?:confused:

RockRunner
12-15-2008, 12:48 PM
The 4Runner started yesterday morning for some Xmas shopping and the temp was up in about a mile or two. :eek: Love that little 22RE, it keeps on rocking.:thumb:

My DD is in the garage and started right up and with the heated seats :D I wasn't to worried about the heater. Still the truck was up to temp only a few blocks past normal. Fresh oil change to 5w 30 sure paid of.:thumb:

Maddmatt
12-15-2008, 01:06 PM
Have to say, I'm loving having both cars in the garage for the first time in three years. Maintained a balmy 38 yesterday per the Subaru's thermometer when we started it for the first time about 6:00pm last night.

Subaru Outbacks have a recurrent issue with developing fuel leaks in extreme cold - the first time it happened to ours it was still under warranty but it's happening again. You know, one of those issues that the service writers have never heard of, but a TSB was issued and fixes are all over the internet? So I wish I had a picture of my 7yo daughter in her "fancy" white coat and new gloves holding the trouble light for me in -5 temps at 8:00pm last night. We found and fixed the leak - but more importantly I wish I had thought to snap a picture - she's a "girly" girl and usually has no interest in "boy" stuff, but was all over fixing the car last night.

So cold starts - no longer an issue - cold weather operation - back on track!
-Matt

corsair23
12-15-2008, 01:39 PM
I actually made a .wav of it years ago during a discussion on mud. This is the sound we're talking about, right? startup zing! (http://risingsun4x4club.org/uploads/nakman/startup_zing.wav)

rest of you 80 guys get this?


I get that and the "goose" honk...I swear there is a goose hiding in my LX somewhere :D

I also finally figured out (I think) where the thunk I'm getting at the DS front is coming from. I can feel it under my "dead" foot when going over bumpy roads or potholes etc. when it is snowy and cold out. It appears that snow/ice accumulates between the sliders and the rear of the front wheel well and body and the slight body movement is giving me an annoying "thunk, thunk, thunk" going down the road...

As for starting...both the :Princess:'s 80 and the LX started up just fine this morning. The 80 is in the garage, the LX outside but I've learned and just changed the oil in the LX to Rotella 5W/40 a week or so ago. That really helps. The 40 started up fine but that was Saturday when some of that Global Warming stuff was happening and keeping us warm :hill:

subzali
12-15-2008, 01:59 PM
First time I've ever had a diesel problem. I most likely have a frozen fuel line between the tank and the filter. I was able to get a few miles down the road on just the fuel in the filter. It started just fine though at -7

Dammit.

Wes,

was that in the Jetta or the BJ70? How is water in a fuel line remedied, I thought it would get passed through with the diesel since diesel floats on water?

nakman
12-15-2008, 02:29 PM
Have to say, I'm loving having both cars in the garage for the first time in three years. Maintained a balmy 38 yesterday per the Subaru's thermometer when we started it for the first time about 6:00pm last night.

Subaru Outbacks have a recurrent issue with developing fuel leaks in extreme cold - the first time it happened to ours it was still under warranty but it's happening again. You know, one of those issues that the service writers have never heard of, but a TSB was issued and fixes are all over the internet? So I wish I had a picture of my 7yo daughter in her "fancy" white coat and new gloves holding the trouble light for me in -5 temps at 8:00pm last night. We found and fixed the leak - but more importantly I wish I had thought to snap a picture - she's a "girly" girl and usually has no interest in "boy" stuff, but was all over fixing the car last night.

So cold starts - no longer an issue - cold weather operation - back on track!
-Matt

Our Subaru is parked today because the gas smell is so bad... we've got an appointment for Friday to get that fixed, along with repairing the neutral position sensor, which is giving us a CEL every now and again. Was refreshing to hear the guy at the shop in Conifer know exactly what was causing both problems, am hopeful they can do a good job on this at more or less a reasonable price.

wesintl
12-15-2008, 02:29 PM
In the jetta TDI. The bj70 has a water seperator to help. You can also add additives to prevent jelling or water freezing in the line. I didn't put anything in it lately and it was parked outside.

Usually you have to drag the vehicle inside and let the line thaw out and then add some diesel winterizer.

I guess I could add some diesel to to filter and get it home rather than with a strap.

Groucho
12-15-2008, 04:13 PM
The .wav file Nakman posted is the tranny. The shriek that I had this morning was the 80's rear heater fan on "HIGH" where the wife left it last night. Sounded like no oil in the beast. Turned it off, waited a minute or two, and back on with no noise. My Heater fan also has made loud noises, but not in the 80, just in the 60.

All but one of mine has made that noise when it's cold. It was -20 out here this morning and it was worse than usual when I fired it up a bit ago. Is it the power steering or the heater?:confused:

nuclearlemon
12-15-2008, 04:35 PM
For those having trans issues due to the cold, put the t case in neutral and the trans in first gear. that will warm the fluid.

MDH33
12-15-2008, 04:36 PM
For those having trans issues due to the cold, put the t case in neutral and the trans in first gear. that will warm the fluid.

What if I can't it into gear?

subzali
12-15-2008, 04:37 PM
keep double-clutching it until it goes :p:

Actually, though, you may have to do what Dave said and check the fluid levels/replace the fluid (good maintenance item anyway), and maybe even drain and refill the tranny to make sure the fluid is clean there too. That's what I would try first, once it warms up again a little bit.

DaveInDenver
12-15-2008, 05:04 PM
keep double-clutching it until it goes :p:

Actually, though, you may have to do what Dave said and check the fluid levels/replace the fluid (good maintenance item anyway), and maybe even drain and refill the tranny to make sure the fluid is clean there too. That's what I would try first, once it warms up again a little bit.
Yeah, just me, but before I assume anything I would do a fluidectomy. A little water (and hydraulic fluid LOVES absorbing water, the dorky guys call it hygroscopic) in the system would make things pretty unhappy I'd bet. Changing brake & clutch fluid is generally a good first step in diagnosis. Of course that assumes you did not do it right after buying that truck, which I know you did a complete fluid change the day you got it home. :-)

Maddmatt
12-15-2008, 05:15 PM
Our Subaru is parked today because the gas smell is so bad... we've got an appointment for Friday to get that fixed, along with repairing the neutral position sensor, which is giving us a CEL every now and again. Was refreshing to hear the guy at the shop in Conifer know exactly what was causing both problems, am hopeful they can do a good job on this at more or less a reasonable price.

EDIT--IT would be worth your time to look for the leak yourself tonight - from what I've experienced and read it WILL NOT leak at temps over 20, it's supposed to be in the 40's on Friday. Also, the engine has to be running, so don't let any straps from your gloves dangle down into the fan :) If you want I'll email you a picture of the connection that was leaking in ours - call my cell.

Yeah, from what I understand from NASIOC and the outback forum the fuel smell is a result of the rubber fuel lines and metal fuel lines contracting at different rates when its very cold. There are several instances where the hard lines connect to rubber lines with simple metal clamp (and I mean SEVERAL, not one or two). My leak last night was on the driver's side at the top of the engine, just forward of the exhaust manifold - a small piece of rubber about 2" long connecting two hard lines. With the engine running you could trace it by smell pretty easy, and then see the fuel on the rubber line. Gave each clamp some gentle turns (I'm always nervous tightening things in sub-zero temps, every since I snapped a ski rack in half in Steamboat one time. Cold does bad things). Was able to get it stopped no problem - I haven't heard any reports of the smell today.

I understand from my research that another common connection requires the removal of some vital and expensive componentry to get to - the types of things that I'm good at removing but bad at reinstalling, so if this doesn't fix it then it goes back to the dealer.

On another cold driving related topic. what's up with people driving around in 4x4 vehicles without the front axle engaged? I'm all for trying to see how far you can get, but not when it interferes with other people. One of the stoplights I drive through (McCaslin and 95th, heading north on 95th/42 for Louisvillians) was held up for 4 cycles this morning by a woman in a fairly clean looking Ford Ranger with nice looking BFG A/T's on it. Her right rear wheel was doing about 45mph while nothing else turned, and she was just staring straight ahead, not moving. It took so long to get past her that I could clearly see the automatic 4x4 hubs on her front wheels. If I remember right, that's a pretty hard to miss dial on the dash on those trucks, just give it a turn! Rant off.
-matt

edog 80
12-15-2008, 05:16 PM
I actually made a .wav of it years ago during a discussion on mud. This is the sound we're talking about, right? startup zing! (http://risingsun4x4club.org/uploads/nakman/startup_zing.wav)

rest of you 80 guys get this?

That's exactly the sound I get. Mine groaned a bit more than usual this morning with the heater though, suprisingly, it started easier than our 2004 minivan.

60wag
12-15-2008, 05:27 PM
FWIW in a manual tranny, the counter shaft gears which are half submerged in oil, are always spinning whether the tranny is in neutral or in gear. Neutral simply uncouples the spinning gears from the output shaft. ie the oil will warm up as long as the engine is spinning the input shaft

DaveInDenver
12-15-2008, 05:42 PM
FWIW in a manual tranny, the counter shaft gears which are half submerged in oil, are always spinning whether the tranny is in neutral or in gear. Neutral simply uncouples the spinning gears from the output shaft. ie the oil will warm up as long as the engine is spinning the input shaft
True, but my thinking is that if the tranny lube needs to be warmed, so would the transfer lube. So putting the t-case in neutral and the tranny in gear would at least spin the input shaft on the t-case, too. Seem logical at least?

bigbluefj
12-15-2008, 08:00 PM
-37F here today glad i had the little mini truck parked inside over night, had to move it sunday morning and it was hard to shift into gear when it was parked out side over night sat..

RicardoJM
12-15-2008, 08:16 PM
Ok, determined not to be totally defeated today I put the jumper cables on when I got home from work and the 40 fired right up. The battery label says 650 CCA at 0 degrees so I speculate that between 0 and minus 6 degrees it drops off too much to be able to start the truck:hill:. Maybe a battery with more that 750 CA is in order.

Caribou Sandstorm
12-15-2008, 09:16 PM
Might as well chime in....The FJC doesn't fit in the garage any longer, so this afternoon I decided I better fire it up.....battery was really straining but it kicked over finally.

I am going through withdrawls something fierce this winter..I have read every Toyota Trails and Overland Journal I have at least 4 times over..funny thing the pictures are still fun to look at..

subzali
12-15-2008, 10:51 PM
Why withdrawals? It's good wheeling season! :D

Beater
12-16-2008, 07:17 AM
old trick - run an old fashioned trouble light (the type with a regular bulb) and place it next to the oil pan, like RIGHT next to it

yes, I grew up "hillbilly"

j

Uncle Ben
12-16-2008, 08:05 AM
Why withdrawals? It's good wheeling season! :D

Agreed! Best wheelin' of the year and often the closest to you! get out there sir! :cool:

nakman
12-19-2008, 09:20 AM
Hey Matt I popped the hood in the Subaru again the other night and tightened all the clamps I could reach, probably 10 of them. I was able to give each 2-3 full turns with the screwdriver :eek: so yeah that must have been the problem... no gas smells the rest of the week though it's been warmer so who knows. It's still on the list for the shop today to double-check. :thumb:

Red_Chili
12-19-2008, 10:03 AM
Might as well chime in....The FJC doesn't fit in the garage any longer..
When we built the garage I had them put the tallest possible (but still 'normal') door in. I'm good for 40s and a roof rack now. :lmao:

Maddmatt
12-19-2008, 10:37 AM
Hey Matt I popped the hood in the Subaru again the other night and tightened all the clamps I could reach, probably 10 of them. I was able to give each 2-3 full turns with the screwdriver :eek: so yeah that must have been the problem... no gas smells the rest of the week though it's been warmer so who knows. It's still on the list for the shop today to double-check. :thumb:

I bet that will do it - this weekend will be another good test :)

subzali
12-19-2008, 01:16 PM
So it hasn't been (as) cold the past few days, but I've been driving the 40 and the thing pops off in the morning like a champ! Can't wait for the colder weather this weekend to give it a try...

When it's really cold, choke full out, two pumps on the gas, crank, fire.
When it's cool/moderately cold out, choke 2/3 out, one or two pumps on the gas, crank, fire. I'm happy :)

As long as my battery holds out until I can adjust my voltage regulator down...

RicardoJM
02-02-2011, 08:15 AM
Bumping this thread up as a place to post up how trucks did in today's cold weather.

I drove the FJ40. It started up ok, a bit slow turning over but came to life ok. My thermometer read -12.8. Both heaters work but with all the drafts and leaks, my cabin did not ever get comfortably warm.

DaveInDenver
02-02-2011, 08:20 AM
Yesterday my truck cranked very slowly but caught. I had to keep the clutch pushed in lest it would stall, though. It was -9F on the bank sign. This morning I'm crossing fingers and toes. It was really cold last night here at Ball. I noticed when I got back to the hotel yesterday morning that I also have coolant leaking, hoping it's only the radiator splitting more and not a freeze plug. My overflow tank was sorta slushy. :-\

Dr. Schlegs
02-02-2011, 08:37 AM
Both heaters work but with all the drafts and leaks, my cabin did not ever get comfortably warm.

You need to put some heated seats in that sucker. :D Maybe get a motorcycle jacket with the built in heater that plugs into the cigarette lighter.

Eldorado556
02-02-2011, 09:08 AM
Unable to start my 60 this morning. Low overnight here was -19. :eek:

Battery ran out of juice after a couple good cranks. Had to try jumping from my Subaru. I'd wait until it was charged and give it a go. No luck. Going to be replacing the 6 year old battery today.

rover67
02-02-2011, 09:45 AM
-13 in boulder at our house...

The 60 fired right up... but then again I have an unfair advantage. Left it in 2nd with the T-Case in neutral to warm up the tranny for a bit and drove off. Clutch was Stiiiiiff.

Speedo was making all kinds of racket. Time to open it up and lube it.

I did notice an exhaust leak though, so that's neat. Those header connector flanges kinda suck. time to do V-Bands.

sardi55
02-02-2011, 10:33 AM
The 60 was a no go this morning so I am stuck driving the 4runner.

Rock Dog
02-02-2011, 12:04 PM
The 80 groaned a bit, and the fan sounded like it was going to come through the hood, but it fired up and ran like a champ...

Should have plugged in the block heater last night, but forgot.. that mistake will not be made tonight....

theboomboom
02-02-2011, 12:26 PM
The mini fired right up :)

FJBRADY
02-02-2011, 12:34 PM
Tundra no problemo....remote start.:thumb:

As for the 40 :dunno:

Rogue Leader
02-02-2011, 12:54 PM
we had -20s to 30s up here two weeks ago. Full choke couple of gas pumps till it catches then back off to half to let it warm up. the new gear reduction starter makes a world of difference as well.

corsair23
02-02-2011, 01:47 PM
The LX fired right up but the PS pump groaned like a goose on its last legs for quite some time - I was watching the intake air temp on the scangauge and it never got above 10F despite the water temp getting to ~180F - That is some cold air out there

RicardoJM
02-02-2011, 02:32 PM
we had -20s to 30s up here two weeks ago. Full choke couple of gas pumps till it catches then back off to half to let it warm up. the new gear reduction starter makes a world of difference as well.

Hey Sean - you still up in AK?

Rogue Leader
02-03-2011, 12:58 AM
Yep still up here, and it's warmer here than there right now

timmbuck2
02-03-2011, 08:22 AM
Here in Indy I woke up Tuesday to my rental Jeep incased in ice...the windshield wipers were frozen under about 3-4: of solid ice...and I had a crappy rental car scraper. 45 minutes later I was able to at least see out the windows and had wipers that worked. I flew all the way out here in the crappy weather at DIA on Monday morning just to work out of my hotel for 3 days. :) Man I don't miss those -20 below mornings in Minnesota...every winter we usually had one stretch where it did not get above 0 for a week or so. Amber was home with the girls this week so don't think she even tried to start her 80.

nattybumppo
02-03-2011, 11:07 AM
Yesterday at -13 the 60 didn't want to start, but by the time it got up to -3 it fired up no problem. Interestingly, somebody tried to steal it that night, small crack in column, key hole slightly damaged, but everything still worked. Ah, north Denver! I also found an exhaust leak at the engine side of the cat. Today it was no problem, cause I put it in the garage last night.