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-   -   Brakes!!! Have a few questions (http://www.risingsun4x4club.org/forum2/showthread.php?t=13442)

RedCreeper 07-02-2010 12:38 AM

Brakes!!! Have a few questions
 
As I know this is not a toyota but the basics should all be the same. After cutting a brake line on the Fathers Day run i got under it and started to takethe parts off so i know what to get or have made. I noticed that the passenger side was set up different than the driver. To start the way it is plumbed does not seem right. from the frame the hard line goes to a braided line then to the axle where a T is and the driver side has a 28 in braided line to the caliper and the passenger side has a small hard line from the T and then a Braided line to the caliper. Also the braided line on the passenger is a smaller diameter than the driver line. Shouldnt these be the same? shouldnt the left and right be plumbed the samehey work even? I was going to get 2 lines the same and get rid of the small hard line from the T and make them the same diameter. is this correct thinking? I have spongy brakes now and have bled them several times and thinking this may cause it. or at least the larger line to one side. Doesnt smaller line have more pressure? Any help or ideas would be great. Also since i lost all the fluid to one side of the master do i need to bench bleed it again or am i ok to just plumb it again and bleed it? I am surprised i am able to stop at all. thanks again in advance.

Kenny

RedCreeper 07-02-2010 12:54 AM

almost forgot that it has discs in the rear and the master is a 2 chamber and a prop valve splitting duty. Also i noticed the front lines are larger also but they are the same on both sides. some folks opinion say i need to put a junction block on it like the original jeeps do so if i do cut a line i will be able to stop and get it home. is this possible or something that can be done? is this a better way to run the system?

corsair23 07-02-2010 11:27 AM

I'm a brake noob and until a couple years ago hadn't even replaced pads or bled brakes before so all I can offer you is a BUMP to the top :)

rover67 07-02-2010 11:47 AM

The different size braided lines shouldn't be causeing a problem assuming they are both rated for brake line use. Also, the hard line going from the Tee to one side is normal..

RedCreeper 07-02-2010 12:31 PM

Thanks gang. Marco, would it hurt to get rid of the hard line used as a splice? Looks hokie. Was going to take the braided line from the caliper directly to the t.

rover67 07-02-2010 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedCreeper (Post 154572)
Thanks gang. Marco, would it hurt to get rid of the hard line used as a splice? Looks hokie. Was going to take the braided line from the caliper directly to the t.

It probably wouldn't hurt, I like to keep the flexible sections short though, it minimizes the amount of line that can flex under pressure. most of the time brake systems have as much hard line as possible with only short flex sections for parts that need them.

RedCreeper 07-02-2010 04:17 PM

Thanks Marco, just got back and have new banjos, fittings and a new line for the passenger side to make it simple. I like to keep as much hard line as possible but this looked hokie as i said. so just got a braided line to match it. i can keep the old piece for a spare part if that side ends up breaking. I also seen that the front lines from the caliper are larger also. Depending on the outcome i may change those to the smaller one for better clamping force. we shall see how all this works out.

Steve 07-03-2010 07:48 AM

Kenny,
Don't waste your money on different hoses for the front. The outside diameter of the hose is not an indicator of its ability to supply "clamping force". You only need to replace them if they are split/damaged/kinked/leaking etc..

The ID of the hose will determine the amount of fluid the hose will flow. I doubt that the different size hoses would flow such a substantially different amount that you could notice anything from side to side or front to rear.

Smaller ID of the hose will NOT increase the pressure at the caliper.

A smaller bore master cylinder will increase the pressure at the slave/caliper/wheel cylinder, compared to a larger bore master at the expense of volume of fluid displaced.

If your brakes are still "spongy", there is still air in the system somewhere.
HTH,
Steve

RedCreeper 07-06-2010 10:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve (Post 154624)
Kenny,
Don't waste your money on different hoses for the front. The outside diameter of the hose is not an indicator of its ability to supply "clamping force". You only need to replace them if they are split/damaged/kinked/leaking etc..

The ID of the hose will determine the amount of fluid the hose will flow. I doubt that the different size hoses would flow such a substantially different amount that you could notice anything from side to side or front to rear.

Smaller ID of the hose will NOT increase the pressure at the caliper.

A smaller bore master cylinder will increase the pressure at the slave/caliper/wheel cylinder, compared to a larger bore master at the expense of volume of fluid displaced.

If your brakes are still "spongy", there is still air in the system somewhere.
HTH,
Steve


Thanks Steve, got it together this past weekend. At least it does not look hokie anymore. I got it out tonight and still spongy. Do i need to bench bleed the master? Any one north have a power bleeder and some time? Maybe that will work. I got speed bleeders and is a nice item but dont think it worked as well as i had heard or hoped. Next step.....

Find a power bleeder and try that. Unless i need to bench bleed it.

Kenny

farnhamstj 07-07-2010 10:36 AM

I know what's wrong....




Sorry Kenny, I can't help myself.


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