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  #51  
Old 01-04-2013, 09:02 AM
SteveH SteveH is offline
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I listened to the noise in Doug's truck, and your video (thanks - very cool!) replicated it pretty well. It was that clatter-clatter-clatter you hear when you put in the clutch under certain turning conditions. To me, it didn't sound damaging, beyond normal 'cruiser sounds.
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  #52  
Old 01-04-2013, 09:13 AM
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Originally Posted by subzali View Post
Randy, there are two different "clunks" the locker is making/causing.

The one you are speaking of is quiet enough that you can't really hear it in my video (it did make that ratcheting sound on my first turn - you might be able to hear it if you turn the volume way up). This clicking is normal and pleasant to hear, IMO.

The second clunk is a lot louder, more violent, and shakes through the drivetrain. That's the one I mainly was trying to capture on the video. This is the one that's no fun to have happen, and is the reason why I coast in neutral a lot whenever anticipating making tight turns.
Understood, I still believe that is the locker winding up and then letting loose. You can even hear the tires screeching before it starts clunking and banging. These things are horrible for exactly these reasons.

I installed a lunchbox locker in the rear of the Blue Mule. First time I drove it on the street, I made a left hand turn into a gas station and had to gas it through the intersection. About halfway through the turn it went BANG! and the whole drive train jerked. I was absolutely sure that I had broken a rear axle. I pulled over and actually jacked the rear end up to determine which axle had broken. Everything was fine, it was just the locker loading up and letting loose. It only did that occassionally but from that time forward I always tried to baby it through turns without giving it gas or by coasting just to avoid a repeat. The next best upgrade I did was replace it with an ARB.
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  #53  
Old 01-04-2013, 09:27 AM
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PabloCruise PabloCruise is offline
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Originally Posted by Air Randy View Post
This is absolutely, positively the sounds a lunchbox locker makes, and under the various conditions you describe.

The locker is basically two round metal pucks with large blocky teeth on them. Each of them is splined and fits over the end of one of your axles. There are springs in the unit that push these two pucks towards each other so the teeth mesh together thus locking the rear axles together.

The unit is designed so that whenever there is any torque from the drive train (i.e. in gear and moving forwards) applied it adds additional compression force in addition to the springs. Thats why if you have the drivetrain under load, even slightly, and you turn sharply on pavement, you may get a loud Bang! as the teeth of the locker disengage. It must either disengage, break an axle, or you would hear the outside tire screeching as it gets drug around the outside of the turn.

When there is no load on the drive train and you turn tightly on pavement, you will either here the teeth of the locker clicking as it disengages and ratchets, or it may be soft enough you dont even hear it. That is all pefectly normal for that type of locker.

The real benefit of this type of locker is they are inexpensive, easy to install and relatively reliable as long as you can put up with the torque steer and funky noises. They can also be a little scary driving on packed snow or ice when turning because you never know if/when they will disengage and give the back end a little twist. If you ever have to side hill off camber on a snowy icey area, you will wish you had a locker you could shut off.

The only way to get rid of the noises you are experiencing is to put in a air or electric operated locker. You can also install a locker like a Detroit Locker and it wont make the noises, but you cant shut it off either. Its almost as costly to put in a Detroit as to put in an ARB anyways.
This is a great description of how my Aussie locker behaves in the back of my 40.
Funny story - after wheeling the 40 for a day, I went to sleep and had a dream (I seldom remember what I dream about) that I was driving my little Honda Civic and I went into a turn and heard the front diff of the Civic clicking like a auto-locker/Aussie! I was totally confused in my dream, trying to figure out how the hell someone fit an auto-locker in the mighty Civic! Too funny. So that is one dream I remember.
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  #54  
Old 01-04-2013, 09:40 AM
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subzali subzali is offline
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Originally Posted by Air Randy View Post
Understood, I still believe that is the locker winding up and then letting loose. You can even hear the tires screeching before it starts clunking and banging. These things are horrible for exactly these reasons.

I installed a lunchbox locker in the rear of the Blue Mule. First time I drove it on the street, I made a left hand turn into a gas station and had to gas it through the intersection. About halfway through the turn it went BANG! and the whole drive train jerked. I was absolutely sure that I had broken a rear axle. I pulled over and actually jacked the rear end up to determine which axle had broken. Everything was fine, it was just the locker loading up and letting loose. It only did that occassionally but from that time forward I always tried to baby it through turns without giving it gas or by coasting just to avoid a repeat. The next best upgrade I did was replace it with an ARB.
Yep, and that is a third noise that the Lockright can make.

Your description of the sidehill behavior of the locker was exactly my sentiment last spring on Rollins Pass Road. Wish I had a selectable in the rear, or one in the front as well as the rear. Some day
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  #55  
Old 01-04-2013, 07:35 PM
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Rzeppa Rzeppa is offline
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Originally Posted by subzali View Post
The second clunk is a lot louder, more violent, and shakes through the drivetrain. That's the one I mainly was trying to capture on the video. This is the one that's no fun to have happen, and is the reason why I coast in neutral a lot whenever anticipating making tight turns.
That is not proper operation of a lunchbox locker. Proper operation is a nice "click click click". Lots of people have come to assume that the loud bang when it locks and then unloads is "normal". It is not.

Since I wrote that article for Toyota Trails about 10-11 years ago about Lock Rights in Land Cruisers, I have learned more. Among them, that there is a bit more to it than simply having clearance between the couplers that is within specification. Two other critical parameters for proper operation are having the entire 3rd set up properly (pinion depth, preload, carrier bearing position and preload) and secondly using 140 wt as recommended by the manufacturer.

ARB and Detroit installs are ALWAYS accompanied by a WHOLE NEW 3rd MEMBER SETUP, and therefore any issues with the existing setup are completely obviated. I discovered this around 2004 when I rebuilt my rear 3rd in my '71 '40. The before and after with the Lock Right was like night and day. No more booms and bangs that I had thought just went with the territory. I also started paying attention to the fact the the instructions recommend 140 wt, which does seem to help.

If you have a lunchbox locker that booms and bangs, obviously the first thing to check is the clearance between the couplers, which is set by the thickness of the thrust washers. If it is within spec, then check all the important measurements of the pinion and carrier. And of course, use 140 wt.
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  #56  
Old 01-05-2013, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Rzeppa View Post
That is not proper operation of a lunchbox locker. Proper operation is a nice "click click click". Lots of people have come to assume that the loud bang when it locks and then unloads is "normal". It is not.

Since I wrote that article for Toyota Trails about 10-11 years ago about Lock Rights in Land Cruisers, I have learned more. Among them, that there is a bit more to it than simply having clearance between the couplers that is within specification. Two other critical parameters for proper operation are having the entire 3rd set up properly (pinion depth, preload, carrier bearing position and preload) and secondly using 140 wt as recommended by the manufacturer.

ARB and Detroit installs are ALWAYS accompanied by a WHOLE NEW 3rd MEMBER SETUP, and therefore any issues with the existing setup are completely obviated. I discovered this around 2004 when I rebuilt my rear 3rd in my '71 '40. The before and after with the Lock Right was like night and day. No more booms and bangs that I had thought just went with the territory. I also started paying attention to the fact the the instructions recommend 140 wt, which does seem to help.

If you have a lunchbox locker that booms and bangs, obviously the first thing to check is the clearance between the couplers, which is set by the thickness of the thrust washers. If it is within spec, then check all the important measurements of the pinion and carrier. And of course, use 140 wt.
Well, I set up a lot of rear ends and I know mine was done correctly and the locker still behaved exactly as I described it above. Now, it was a used unit so were the cogs worn causing it to let loose occassionally? Maybe, but I have also talked to lots of other folks who have experienced the same behavior.
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  #57  
Old 01-05-2013, 04:56 PM
Telly Telly is offline
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Yes sir Matt, that's the noise and thanks for posting the vid! Mine seems be be a bit louder than yours. Sometime in the next 6 months, I plan to verify diff clearances and fill with 140wt. Maybe that will quiet it down some.
Took me awhile to respond...just got back from a week at Disney World. Neat park but I'm done waiting in lines for awhile. Doug
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  #58  
Old 01-05-2013, 05:06 PM
Telly Telly is offline
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One more thing...I'm learning to like the locker. Drove around in the snow and it did awesome in 2wd. Time to start sourcing parts for a mini truck power steering! POW!
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  #59  
Old 01-07-2013, 06:20 PM
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Rzeppa Rzeppa is offline
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Originally Posted by Air Randy View Post
Well, I set up a lot of rear ends and I know mine was done correctly and the locker still behaved exactly as I described it above. Now, it was a used unit so were the cogs worn causing it to let loose occassionally? Maybe, but I have also talked to lots of other folks who have experienced the same behavior.
My experience is an A-B comparison on the exact same rig, exact same locker. Rebuild the diff, Oh what a feeling!



My HZJ75 pickup was quite and smooth, my current FJ60 wagon is quite and smooth.
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